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What’s wrong with Nebido
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<blockquote data-quote="Cataceous" data-source="post: 219817" data-attributes="member: 38109"><p>This doesn't make sense. What does it even mean to say "the testosterone cleaves off the ester more regularly"? Testosterone esters are basically inert at their injection sites. As they are slowly absorbed the testosterone esters reach the bloodstream, at which point the esters are cleaved from the testosterone. Then you get free testosterone, regardless of whether the ester is propionate, cypionate or undecanoate. The only proven difference is in the rate of absorption. If you dose your testosterone esters at an adequate frequency and if the amount of testosterone given over time is the same then there will be virtually no difference between the different esters. For example, assuming typical absorption rates, taking 100 mg testosterone undecanoate once a week is similar to taking 13 mg testosterone cypionate daily or to taking 2.2 mg testosterone propionate every five hours.</p><p></p><p>Regarding the anecdote with low free T: Was this free testosterone measured via equilibrium dialysis or ultrafiltration? If not then it's essentially meaningless and probably wrong. The free T calculators suggest normal free testosterone with these numbers. And regardless, it has little to do with the ester. You'll end up with low free testosterone at troughs with any ester if you don't inject often enough relative to the half-life of the ester.</p><p></p><p>Aside from cost, the main issue with undecanoate is the long half-life. It's good if you want stable serum testosterone with less frequent injections. It's bad when you're trying to make dose adjustments and have to wait months for things to settle down. A reasonable workaround is to start TRT with daily or EOD injections of testosterone cypionate, continuing until a satisfactory dose is found. Then switch to weekly or E2W injections of testosterone undecanoate.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Cataceous, post: 219817, member: 38109"] This doesn't make sense. What does it even mean to say "the testosterone cleaves off the ester more regularly"? Testosterone esters are basically inert at their injection sites. As they are slowly absorbed the testosterone esters reach the bloodstream, at which point the esters are cleaved from the testosterone. Then you get free testosterone, regardless of whether the ester is propionate, cypionate or undecanoate. The only proven difference is in the rate of absorption. If you dose your testosterone esters at an adequate frequency and if the amount of testosterone given over time is the same then there will be virtually no difference between the different esters. For example, assuming typical absorption rates, taking 100 mg testosterone undecanoate once a week is similar to taking 13 mg testosterone cypionate daily or to taking 2.2 mg testosterone propionate every five hours. Regarding the anecdote with low free T: Was this free testosterone measured via equilibrium dialysis or ultrafiltration? If not then it's essentially meaningless and probably wrong. The free T calculators suggest normal free testosterone with these numbers. And regardless, it has little to do with the ester. You'll end up with low free testosterone at troughs with any ester if you don't inject often enough relative to the half-life of the ester. Aside from cost, the main issue with undecanoate is the long half-life. It's good if you want stable serum testosterone with less frequent injections. It's bad when you're trying to make dose adjustments and have to wait months for things to settle down. A reasonable workaround is to start TRT with daily or EOD injections of testosterone cypionate, continuing until a satisfactory dose is found. Then switch to weekly or E2W injections of testosterone undecanoate. [/QUOTE]
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