Thoughts on Progesterone

[bigfred32]

Spoke with my doctor the other day and reviewed recent bw.

TT- 759. (250-1100)
FT - 102. (46-224)
Bio - 201. (110-575)
SHBG. 37. (10-50)
E2. 40. ( less 29) ultra sensitive test
DHT. 178. (16-79)
DHEA. 558. (38-313)

On a compounded TD. 150mg T daily along with compounded pill of DHEA, zinc and chrysin. She is lowering the dhea and wants to add progesterone to the compounded cream to lower the DHT. Also take .25mg AI every 3.5 days. I use Nelsons ratio and keep E2 between 14-20 based on total T. (T÷e2) currently 18.

My DHT has always run high, even before TRT as I have always been a weight lifter, b I dy builder and have used supplements for past 35+ years.

Unfortunately we never established a baseline of DHT when I started TRT over a year ago.

She wants to add Progesterone in order to lower DHT and try it for 3 months to see how I feel. She is concerned about the high DHT, howerver my PSA is .04 and with exception of some acne, no other issues.

I have googled and read everything I can find on Progesterone including everything on Lee Myers site (Peaktestosterone) and (mesorx, body building forums and allthingsmale)

It seems its split 50/50 on good or bad but no real studies or experiences that convince me to NOT try it.

I read an old thread by Nelson who is catagorically opposed to using progesterone based on a couple reasons he stated, but the thread is a couple years old so not sure if its outdated.

Currently I feel fantastic in every catagory with exception of acne.

Reading that Progesterone will increase libido and erections and lean out more have me intrigued. It also will lower e2 so eliminate need of AI.

I currently use Genes NO stack with exception of cialis and frankly dont need it right now even at 52 years old, however increased sexual function and libido is something all men want!

Not going to try it until I renew script in september so plenty of time to make a final decision on whether to try it.

Anyone with thoughts or experince would be greatly appreciated

 

[ERO]

I use progesterone and find it helpful for sleep I find it slightly increases my libido. Contrary to most views, it is not a feminizing hormone.

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Progesterone_Men.aspx

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Progesterone_Erectile_Dysfunction.aspx

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Progesterone_Dangers.aspx

That said, I am sure that it does not work the same for everybody. Also, with your PSA that low, I do not see any good reason to worry about high DHT. In fact, one generally WANTS high DHT as long as PSA is good and your hair is not falling out. Low DHT often = low libido and nobody wants that.

 

[bigfred32]

Actually psa is .4 not .04. I agree with the higher DHT, I feel great, she the one hung up on it, but.....shes a. DR and Im not, but ultimatley its my body, not sure if adding progesterone is necessarily bad, as it has many other benefits.
I read an article that it can restore some testicle size after loss through TRT somewhat like HCG, which I dont currently take and controlling e2 without having to take an AI

 

[CoastWatcher]

Actually psa is .4 not .04. I agree with the higher DHT, I feel great, she the one hung up on it, but.....shes a. DR and Im not, but ultimatley its my body, not sure if adding progesterone is necessarily bad, as it has many other benefits.
I read an article that it can restore some testicle size after loss through TRT somewhat like HCG, which I dont currently take and controlling e2 without having to take an AI

Have you asked her how many patients of hers have been prescribed progesterone? What's her personal experience with it?

 

[Vettester Chris]

I tend to agree with Nelson about this subject. I think progesterone is a GREAT equalizer for estrogen dominant women, especially in regards to the adrenals and the thyroid. However, for men, I would think that a small dosage of anastrozole would be the ticket in cases like yours, where E2 is a bit elevated, but nothing that can't be managed fairly quickly.

 

[Gene Devine]

If you have no negative sides with the elevated DHT than what's the problem?

Other then potential hair loss and all other labs in pretty decent shape I personally wouldn't worry about it.

DHT is not your enemy...in fact, it is about 7 to 10 times more androgenic than Testosterone and is what makes you a man...and the biggest driver behind muscle mass and libido.

And contrary to Progesterone not being a feminizing hormone; I respectfully disagree as it is.

Men don't need Progesterone in my opinion.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

I have strong biases against progesterone treatment since it is well known that it increases the risks of blood clots and fat gain if not dosed properly.

High DHT is not necessarily bad if you do not have prostatic inflammation. DHT is responsible for a lot of the good benefits of TRT. It is directly linked to sex drive and even strength. You can manage acne with Nizoral shampoo as a body wash, getting sun once or twice per week, zinc supplementation, and acne washes.

 

[bigfred32]

I have researched everything I can find in last few days and found tons of information on sites. Its kind of crazy but there are as many pro as there are con opinions about adding progesterone to aTRT regimine. Im going to call the doc next week and ask a few more questions regarding the addition of progesterone to my TRT and exactly why.
If its just to deal with DHT im gonna pass since I have absolutly no adverse effects except some acne flare ups which I manage with doxycycline.
If she wants to add it for other reasons, we can discuss the pros and cons and why.
I find discussions and research like this are so educational for guys like me, sometimes I think we know more than some doctors especially in this field. They "practice medicine"...but we live it!

 

[DHM]

Higher SHBG and E2 typically signs your liver likes to convert.

Would it be out of the question to drop DHEA, Chrysin, and pass on the progesterone for now? (DHEA converts via pathway that sidesteps AIs).

See how you feel on TD and vitamins, simple and definitely cheaper.

Draw labs in 8 weeks and make the decision to spend $$$ on AI, DHEA, etc.

Good chance you'll need an AI, but better if you can get away without it.

 

[bigfred32]

Found this article this morning and thought it was pretty interesting especially when comparing progesterone and Deca.


https://thinksteroids.com/articles/contrarian-endocrinology-estrogen-men/

 

[ERO]

Great article, thank you for posting. I have used progesterone topically and felt better for it and had no issues with higher E2 or fat gain. I also know that everybody is different and for some it may not at all beneficial. I am sure the dosing is important as well. I was using a small daily dose of around 10 mg.

 

[CoastWatcher]

Great article, thank you for posting. I have used progesterone topically and felt better for it and had no issues with higher E2 or fat gain. I also know that everybody is different and for some it may not at all beneficial. I am sure the dosing is important as well. I was using a small daily dose of around 10 mg.

ERO, excuse me if I overlooked this, but why did you discontinue progesterone?

 

[ERO]

ERO, excuse me if I overlooked this, but why did you discontinue progesterone?

Honestly, it was just because I ran out of the topical creme and did not buy anymore. I may start it up again though as it is cheap and you can get it at Amazon. With me and my low SHBG and low E2 (Sounds crazy, I know - but I have both low SHBG and low E2). TRT is a huge "meh" for me no matter what I do or what protocol I follow, so while I noticed a bit of improved sleep and perhaps a tiny bit more libido, it was not a huge enough improvement to run out and buy more right away.

 

[bigfred32]

I have a couple thoughts going here on this forum in my search for a new doctor since my move across country, anyway, I started using my new cream that was compounded with 10mg Progesterone for about the last 2 weeks.

Im here to say that my libido is ramped up and OFF the charts right now! My wife is paying the price! Lol

I also cut down on my AI to .25mg only once a week since PG blocks some aromatase activity and dont notice any adverse effects.

Currently talking with a new doctor who also belives in PG for men, even saying this one area he disagrees with Dr Chrisler about the benefits.

Just wanted to update

 

[ERO]

Good to know - thank you for updating this thread!

 

[Nelson Vergel]

I have a couple thoughts going here on this forum in my search for a new doctor since my move across country, anyway, I started using my new cream that was compounded with 10mg Progesterone for about the last 2 weeks.

Im here to say that my libido is ramped up and OFF the charts right now! My wife is paying the price! Lol

I also cut down on my AI to .25mg only once a week since PG blocks some aromatase activity and dont notice any adverse effects.

Currently talking with a new doctor who also belives in PG for men, even saying this one area he disagrees with Dr Chrisler about the benefits.

Just wanted to update

@bigfred32

Any udates?