Subcutaneous Injection

[TDM812]

5.5 weeks ago I changed my dosing from 140x1 IM weekly, to 70x2 SC. I am a relatively lean guy, so it’s hard to tell if I am getting the needle into the fat. What happens if the oil goes into the space between the muscle, and the actual fat layer? I am asking because I finally hit my “sweet spot” on Friday morning, and by Friday night I was weak, tired (very), etc. I know what high/low estrogen feels like, and that’s not it. So, I am wondering if I injected it into that space, and the oil didn’t make it into the fat, thus not being absorbed. Make sense?

 

[Deleted member 16042]

What is your SHBG?

 

[TDM812]

53

 

[TDM812]

What is your SHBG?

53

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Thanks, just wanted to rule in or out possible low SHBG and dosing frequency issue. Unlikely your SHBG at 53 is related to this. But, my SHBG is essentially the same as yours and dosing at Q3D I had E2 mood swings and bloating on a 3 day cycle dosing Q3D.

I went to QOD and those swings are gone.

I also lowered dose.

I inject subQ, and am also very lean. I inject literally subQ, meaning under the skin. I use many sites around my middle. Some more into the slight fat layer, some more in the subQ space. Absolutely no notable problem in this regard.

So, there are other things that can cause such symptoms related or unrelated to you TRT. If it is repeatable same day same time, more likely it's from your dosing schedule/method in some way

 

[TDM812]

Thanks, just wanted to rule in or out possible low SHBG and dosing frequency issue. Unlikely your SHBG at 53 is related to this. But, my SHBG is essentially the same as yours and dosing at Q3D I had E2 mood swings and bloating on a 3 day cycle dosing Q3D.

I went to QOD and those swings are gone.

I also lowered dose.

I inject subQ, and am also very lean. I inject literally subQ, meaning under the skin. I use many sites around my middle. Some more into the slight fat layer, some more in the subQ space.

Thank you, for your insight. I’m at a loss. I feel like garbage - like I don’t want to get out of bed, I’m so weak it’s taxing to lift my arms, I just want to sleep....a lot.

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Some guys attribute not doing well to SubQ. One way to find out, but it takes experimentation.

So what other things might also be affecting your symptoms? Other illness, depression, bad sleep, sleep apnea, hangover, general inflammation from what kind of cause, etc?

Still could be due to your dosing change, if you went to 2x/week you may just be feeling the lack of higher peak from the larger dose.

 

[TDM812]

Some guys attribute not doing well to SubQ. One way to find out, but it takes experimentation.

So what other things might also be affecting your symptoms? Other illness, depression, bad sleep, sleep apnea, hangover, general inflammation from what kind of cause, etc?

Still could be due to your dosing change, if you went to 2x/week you may just be feeling the lack of higher peak from the larger dose.

Everything else is good, no issues. It was just weird that I was Superman throughout the day, and then mid-workout Friday everything went to garbage.

 

[madman]

5.5 weeks ago I changed my dosing from 140x1 IM weekly, to 70x2 SC. I am a relatively lean guy, so it’s hard to tell if I am getting the needle into the fat. What happens if the oil goes into the space between the muscle, and the actual fat layer? I am asking because I finally hit my “sweet spot” on Friday morning, and by Friday night I was weak, tired (very), etc. I know what high/low estrogen feels like, and that’s not it. So, I am wondering if I injected it into that space, and the oil didn’t make it into the fat, thus not being absorbed. Make sense?

Would make absolutely no difference an even than you are most likely injecting into adipose or shallow i.m.

If you are expecting the so called sweet spot 24/7 you are in for a world of hurt.....way too many variables other than hormones can effect how one feels mentally/physically day to day.

 

[TDM812]

Would make absolutely no difference an even than you are most likely injecting into adipose or shallow i.m.

If you are expecting the so called sweet spot 24/7 you are in for a world of hurt.....way too many variables other than hormones can effect how one feels mentally/physically day to day.

That’s good to hear. I thought maybe I had been improperly injecting, and maybe it caused my T levels to tank. It doesn’t make sense. I went from Superman to bone crushing fatigue, weakness, sleepiness, etc. at the drop of a pin. It’s like my gas tank ran empty, and has stayed that way for 2 days now. Any other suspicions?

 

[fifty]

At least for HCG, studies show a huge spike for IM but a much lower and more even "spike" for subq. I am thinking of the study that shows a chart with 4 lines: subq and IM, obese, and non-obese people hcg inections.

 

[MensHealth]

5.5 weeks ago I changed my dosing from 140x1 IM weekly, to 70x2 SC. I am a relatively lean guy, so it’s hard to tell if I am getting the needle into the fat. What happens if the oil goes into the space between the muscle, and the actual fat layer? I am asking because I finally hit my “sweet spot” on Friday morning, and by Friday night I was weak, tired (very), etc. I know what high/low estrogen feels like, and that’s not it. So, I am wondering if I injected it into that space, and the oil didn’t make it into the fat, thus not being absorbed. Make sense?

Why did you change from IM to SQ? Was IM working for you? IM is still the most studied and most widely used even though some physicians are offering and touting SQ injections. When you inject SQ don't get anywhere near your belly button. Keep the injections away from your midline.

 

[TDM812]

Why did you change from IM to SQ? Was IM working for you? IM is still the most studied and most widely used even though some physicians are offering and touting SQ injections. When you inject SQ don't get anywhere near your belly button. Keep the injections away from your midline.

Thank you for the advice. What are the challenges with the midline? I switched in an attempt to mitigate the challenges associated with high estrogen. While it has certainly lowered it, my free and total T is considerably lower too. I just got labs back this morning, and it looks like I’m stable at about 800 total and 1.6 free. Previously, I was at 1200 total/5 free - same total dose 140mg weekly.

 

[fifty]

That is quite a change

 

[TDM812]

That is quite a change

Do you think I’m having absorption issues?

 

[fifty]

I have always felt that when I do subq with HCG...it seems to get absorbed way better if I inject in my love handles compared to my abdomen. And yes I always stay away from the 2" radius surrounding my belly button. I have no data to prove this. It's just subjective.

 

[Cataceous]

... it looks like I’m stable at about 800 total and 1.6 free. Previously, I was at 1200 total/5 free - same total dose 140mg weekly.

When was testing done relative to injections? As long as you didn't have injection site leakage you should absorb the whole dose. SubQ has been shown to absorb a little more slowly than IM, but in the end you're getting all the testosterone.

 

[MensHealth]

Have you seen studies on the absorption rate of an oil based product SubQ? Or the long term side effects of injecting testosterone SubQ? IM is still the most studied way of injecting testosterone.

Here is what an infected SubQ injection can look like. This is after it has been drained at Urgent Care. This was also injected to close to the midline.

 

[S1W]

Have you seen studies on the absorption rate of an oil based product SubQ? Or the long term side effects of injecting testosterone SubQ? IM is still the most studied way of injecting testosterone.

Here is what an infected SubQ injection can look like. This is after it has been drained at Urgent Care. This was also injected to close to the midline.

A few questions for you if you don't mind:

- Assuming equal sterilization procedures are followed, why would a SubQ injection be any more or less prone to infection than an IM injection?

- What are the long-term side effects of SubQ injections?

- I have had great results with absorption over the past year plus of injecting SubQ. I believe there are studies that support this. Are there studies in which SubQ is contraindicated?

 

[Deleted member 16042]

Have you seen studies on the absorption rate of an oil based product SubQ? Or the long term side effects of injecting testosterone SubQ? IM is still the most studied way of injecting testosterone.

Here is what an infected SubQ injection can look like. This is after it has been drained at Urgent Care. This was also injected to close to the midline.

Fer Krissake, the scare tactics are not representative of SubQ vs IM. Any injection can go septic if proper sterile protocol is not followed.

INFECTIONS, DIABETIC FOOT, NON HEALING WOUNDS AND LIMB SALVAGE: POST INTRAMUSCULAR INJECTION SOFT TISSUE NECROSIS - SEPSIS - GLUTEAL REGION


Use proper sterile technique with any injection.