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Testosterone Replacement, Low T, HCG, & Beyond
Testosterone Basics & Questions
Sensitive to E2 - subq and HCG
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<blockquote data-quote="madman" data-source="post: 189518" data-attributes="member: 13851"><p><span style="color: rgb(184, 49, 47)">is everybody injecting into their stomach fat? And does it not show if you're doing it repeatedly? I'm more comfortable doing it in areas no one will look at.</span></p><p></p><p>Whether injecting IM (deep/shallow) or sub-q you have many options for injection sites.</p><p></p><p>Although when injecting strictly sub-q the abdominal region may be more common there are many other sites to choose from.</p><p></p><p>Most on trt are using fixed insulin syringes 27-31G (various needle lengths) and when injecting sub-q or IM scar tissue/trauma would be minimal.</p><p></p><p>Something to keep in mind is there are some men who do not do well-injecting sub-q as it can cause lump/swelling but is far from common and usually happens when injecting high volumes of oil/too fast or one has a sensitivity to the ester/excipients.</p><p></p><p>Also, some claim to have issues with absorption which is far from common.</p><p></p><p>Injecting strictly sub-q may be less painful/minimize tissue trauma but again it comes down to the individual.</p><p></p><p>You need to find what method suits you best.</p><p></p><p>[URL unfurl="true"]https://www.excelmale.com/forum/threads/principles-of-testosterone-and-hcg-injection-technique.20198/#post-166995[/URL]</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p><span style="color: rgb(184, 49, 47)">I'm high SHBG in general and we chose to split the dose up for M/W/F. I think that was to address the problem I seem to have with E2. But what does it mean for SHBG?</span></p><p></p><p>Injecting higher doses once weekly would have a larger impact on driving down SHBG but even then it depends on the individual as some may notice a larger drop and others not so drastic.</p><p></p><p>Depending on dose T used/injection frequency it is not a given that SHBG will be driven down as some will only notice a slight drop or it stays around pre-trt levels.</p><p></p><p>Pre-trt my SHBG was 34 nmol/L.</p><p></p><p>I have been on trt for almost 4 years (T only protocol) no AI/hCG and I was injecting 150 mg/week (75 mg every 3.5 days) my SHBG barely budged as it now sits at 30-31 nmol/L and that is with high TT/FT levels.</p><p></p><p>To be honest the c-17 alpha-alkylated orals such as methyltestosterone, oxandrolone, stanozolol, methandrostenolone, fluoxymesterone, and oxymetholone would have the biggest impact on driving down SHBG.</p><p></p><p>Some on trt is adding low doses of oxandrolone or stanozolol for such purpose but it is not something you would want to stay on for the long-term as they can have a negative effect on lipids (drive down HDL/raise LDL) depending on the dose used.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p><span style="color: rgb(184, 49, 47)">He mentioned that Proviron might be a solution for the SHBG, do you have any experience with that?</span></p><p></p><p>Mesterolone is very effective when used in the right dose but it is not used in the US let alone some other countries.</p><p></p><p><em><u><strong>*In fact, <span style="color: rgb(184, 49, 47)">due to its extremely high affinity for plasma binding proteins such as SHBG</span>, mesterolone may actually work to potentate the activity of other steroids by displacing a higher percentage into a free, unbound state</strong></u><strong>.</strong></em></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>[URL unfurl="true"]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-Hohl2017-26[/URL]</p><p></p><p><strong>Availability</strong></p><p>Mesterolone is available widely throughout the world, including in the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom" target="_blank">United Kingdom</a>, <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia" target="_blank">Australia</a>, and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Africa" target="_blank">South Africa</a>, as well as many non-<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language" target="_blank">English</a>-speaking countries.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-IndexNominum2000-19" target="_blank">[19]</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-Drugs.com-29" target="_blank">[29]</a> <span style="color: rgb(44, 130, 201)"><u>It is not available in the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States" target="_blank">United States</a>, <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada" target="_blank">Canada</a>, or <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand" target="_blank">New Zealand</a>.</u><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-IndexNominum2000-19" target="_blank">[19]</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-Drugs.com-29" target="_blank">[29]</a> <u>The drug has never been marketed in the United States.</u><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-Hohl2017-26" target="_blank"><u>[</u>26]</a></span></p><p></p><p><strong>Legal status</strong></p><p><span style="color: rgb(44, 130, 201)"><u>Mesterolone, along with other AAS, is a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Substances_Act#Schedule_III_controlled_substances" target="_blank">schedule III</a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_substance" target="_blank">controlled substance</a> in the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States" target="_blank">United States</a> under the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Substances_Act" target="_blank">Controlled Substances Act</a> and a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Drugs_and_Substances_Act#Schedule_IV" target="_blank">schedule IV</a> controlled substance in <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada" target="_blank">Canada</a> under the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Drugs_and_Substances_Act" target="_blank">Controlled Drugs and Substances Act</a>.</u><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-FFFLM2006-9" target="_blank">[9]</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-LilleySnyder2016-30" target="_blank">[30]</a></span></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p><strong>William Llewellyn's <span style="color: rgb(184, 49, 47)">ANABOLICS</span></strong></p><p><strong></strong></p><p><strong>Description:</strong> <span style="color: rgb(184, 49, 47)"><em>Proviron® is Schering’s (now Bayer’s) brand name for the oral androgen mesterolone (1-methyl dihydrotestosterone). Similar to dihydrotestosterone, mesterolone is a strong androgen with only a weak level of anabolic activity. This is due to the fact that like dihydrotestosterone, mesterolone is rapidly reduced to inactive diol metabolites in muscle tissue where concentrations of the 3-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase enzyme are high. </em></span>The belief that the weak anabolic nature of this compound indicates a tendency to block the androgen receptor in muscle tissue, thereby reducing the gains of other more potent muscle-building steroids, should likewise not be taken seriously. <span style="color: rgb(44, 130, 201)"><em><u><strong>In fact, due to its extremely high affinity for plasma binding proteins such as SHBG, mesterolone may actually work to potentate the activity of other steroids by displacing a higher percentage into a free, unbound state</strong></u><strong>.</strong></em></span> Among athletes, mesterolone is primarily used to increase androgen levels when dieting or preparing for a contest, and as an anti-estrogen due to its intrinsic ability to antagonize the aromatase enzyme.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p><span style="color: rgb(184, 49, 47)"><strong><u>This doctor seemed to care about getting my free testosterone up to a good level, as opposed to just looking at total T</u>.</strong> I've almost always just looked at total T so I find it hard to imagine what a good level of FT is like.</span></p><p></p><p>That is what you want to hear.</p><p></p><p>Although TT is important to know many including most of the uniformed doctors do not understand that FT is what truly matters as it is the active unbound fraction of testosterone responsible for the beneficial effects.</p><p></p><p>Testosterone and more importantly its metabolites estradiol/DHT plays a huge role and is needed in healthy amounts to experiencing the full spectrum of beneficial effects.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="madman, post: 189518, member: 13851"] [COLOR=rgb(184, 49, 47)]is everybody injecting into their stomach fat? And does it not show if you're doing it repeatedly? I'm more comfortable doing it in areas no one will look at.[/COLOR] Whether injecting IM (deep/shallow) or sub-q you have many options for injection sites. Although when injecting strictly sub-q the abdominal region may be more common there are many other sites to choose from. Most on trt are using fixed insulin syringes 27-31G (various needle lengths) and when injecting sub-q or IM scar tissue/trauma would be minimal. Something to keep in mind is there are some men who do not do well-injecting sub-q as it can cause lump/swelling but is far from common and usually happens when injecting high volumes of oil/too fast or one has a sensitivity to the ester/excipients. Also, some claim to have issues with absorption which is far from common. Injecting strictly sub-q may be less painful/minimize tissue trauma but again it comes down to the individual. You need to find what method suits you best. [URL unfurl="true"]https://www.excelmale.com/forum/threads/principles-of-testosterone-and-hcg-injection-technique.20198/#post-166995[/URL] [COLOR=rgb(184, 49, 47)]I'm high SHBG in general and we chose to split the dose up for M/W/F. I think that was to address the problem I seem to have with E2. But what does it mean for SHBG?[/COLOR] Injecting higher doses once weekly would have a larger impact on driving down SHBG but even then it depends on the individual as some may notice a larger drop and others not so drastic. Depending on dose T used/injection frequency it is not a given that SHBG will be driven down as some will only notice a slight drop or it stays around pre-trt levels. Pre-trt my SHBG was 34 nmol/L. I have been on trt for almost 4 years (T only protocol) no AI/hCG and I was injecting 150 mg/week (75 mg every 3.5 days) my SHBG barely budged as it now sits at 30-31 nmol/L and that is with high TT/FT levels. To be honest the c-17 alpha-alkylated orals such as methyltestosterone, oxandrolone, stanozolol, methandrostenolone, fluoxymesterone, and oxymetholone would have the biggest impact on driving down SHBG. Some on trt is adding low doses of oxandrolone or stanozolol for such purpose but it is not something you would want to stay on for the long-term as they can have a negative effect on lipids (drive down HDL/raise LDL) depending on the dose used. [COLOR=rgb(184, 49, 47)]He mentioned that Proviron might be a solution for the SHBG, do you have any experience with that?[/COLOR] Mesterolone is very effective when used in the right dose but it is not used in the US let alone some other countries. [I][U][B]*In fact, [COLOR=rgb(184, 49, 47)]due to its extremely high affinity for plasma binding proteins such as SHBG[/COLOR], mesterolone may actually work to potentate the activity of other steroids by displacing a higher percentage into a free, unbound state[/B][/U][B].[/B][/I] [URL unfurl="true"]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-Hohl2017-26[/URL] [B]Availability[/B] Mesterolone is available widely throughout the world, including in the [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom']United Kingdom[/URL], [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia']Australia[/URL], and [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Africa']South Africa[/URL], as well as many non-[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language']English[/URL]-speaking countries.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-IndexNominum2000-19'][19][/URL][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-Drugs.com-29'][29][/URL] [COLOR=rgb(44, 130, 201)][U]It is not available in the [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States']United States[/URL], [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada']Canada[/URL], or [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand']New Zealand[/URL].[/U][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-IndexNominum2000-19'][19][/URL][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-Drugs.com-29'][29][/URL] [U]The drug has never been marketed in the United States.[/U][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-Hohl2017-26'][U][[/U]26][/URL][/COLOR] [B]Legal status[/B] [COLOR=rgb(44, 130, 201)][U]Mesterolone, along with other AAS, is a [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Substances_Act#Schedule_III_controlled_substances']schedule III[/URL] [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_substance']controlled substance[/URL] in the [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States']United States[/URL] under the [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Substances_Act']Controlled Substances Act[/URL] and a [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Drugs_and_Substances_Act#Schedule_IV']schedule IV[/URL] controlled substance in [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada']Canada[/URL] under the [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_Drugs_and_Substances_Act']Controlled Drugs and Substances Act[/URL].[/U][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-FFFLM2006-9'][9][/URL][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesterolone#cite_note-LilleySnyder2016-30'][30][/URL][/COLOR] [B]William Llewellyn's [COLOR=rgb(184, 49, 47)]ANABOLICS[/COLOR] Description:[/B] [COLOR=rgb(184, 49, 47)][I]Proviron® is Schering’s (now Bayer’s) brand name for the oral androgen mesterolone (1-methyl dihydrotestosterone). Similar to dihydrotestosterone, mesterolone is a strong androgen with only a weak level of anabolic activity. This is due to the fact that like dihydrotestosterone, mesterolone is rapidly reduced to inactive diol metabolites in muscle tissue where concentrations of the 3-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase enzyme are high. [/I][/COLOR]The belief that the weak anabolic nature of this compound indicates a tendency to block the androgen receptor in muscle tissue, thereby reducing the gains of other more potent muscle-building steroids, should likewise not be taken seriously. [COLOR=rgb(44, 130, 201)][I][U][B]In fact, due to its extremely high affinity for plasma binding proteins such as SHBG, mesterolone may actually work to potentate the activity of other steroids by displacing a higher percentage into a free, unbound state[/B][/U][B].[/B][/I][/COLOR] Among athletes, mesterolone is primarily used to increase androgen levels when dieting or preparing for a contest, and as an anti-estrogen due to its intrinsic ability to antagonize the aromatase enzyme. [COLOR=rgb(184, 49, 47)][B][U]This doctor seemed to care about getting my free testosterone up to a good level, as opposed to just looking at total T[/U].[/B] I've almost always just looked at total T so I find it hard to imagine what a good level of FT is like.[/COLOR] That is what you want to hear. Although TT is important to know many including most of the uniformed doctors do not understand that FT is what truly matters as it is the active unbound fraction of testosterone responsible for the beneficial effects. Testosterone and more importantly its metabolites estradiol/DHT plays a huge role and is needed in healthy amounts to experiencing the full spectrum of beneficial effects. [/QUOTE]
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