New guy intro

[whosaidthat]

Hey guys,

It's been a long journey to get to this point, sitting in front of the computer writing to this community, and I'm really happy to have found it. Starting with the numbers:

Stats
Age: 27
Total testosterone: 420
Free testosterone: 11

Fun symptoms
No libido
No morning wood
Low response to exercise
Depressed mood, low self-esteem
Irritable, anxious, anti-social

There's always a question of whether depression is causing the ED problems or whether low testosterone is causing the depression but over time I've been more and more convinced that it's the latter. I once used Test C on my own and all of my depressive symptoms disappeared almost immediately.

Anyway, I've been religious about living a "high testosterone lifestyle", lifting heavy weights, eating cleanly (and eating a lot), not drinking or smoking, etc and it's really frustrating to feel like I'm working 10x harder than most and still looking like I barely workout.

Most doctors I ask about this tell me my levels are nothing to be concerned about or that I'm too young to consider TRT, but recently I've found a doctor who seems to be on the same page. My T is low but not crazy low, but could definitely be better (should I have to put up with low T symptoms just because it's not out of some arbitrary range?) and is considering Clomid + hCG to maintain fertility.

Curious to hear if anyone has experience with this combo and looking forward to learning from all of you. Thanks for reading.

 

[Vince]

Yes your testosterone is very low, especially for a 27 year old man. It makes me wonder if your on any meds that's lowing your testosterone levels. It would be nice if you posted all your labs, along with the ranges.

 

[whosaidthat]

sure, I’m attaching the labs now. There’s some variation from time to time obviously but these are pretty representative

 

[whosaidthat]

Also no medications that would be causing low levels. I took Zoloft for a short time but these were my levels before starting that.

 

[Vince]

You do have low levels of testosterone. They did give you the wrong estrogen test, they should have gave you the one for men. Sensitive estrogen LC/MS/MS

 

[Vince]

Semen analysis results after adding FSH to TRT and hCG

 

[Gman86]

Long story short, I would just freeze some sperm, and hop on HRT. I was exactly 27 when I went on HRT. I'm 33 now. I went through trialing everything, HCG mono, clomid mono, testosterone with HCG, and now on testosterone without HCG. I got my ex girlfriend pregnant, at the beginning of this year, while completely being off HCG for 2 months, and on testosterone by itself. I was previously on testosterone and HCG for a few years prior to this. So don't be overly concerned with fertility.

I was just like you, I was the healthiest eater out of anybody I knew, and had been going to the gym since I was 14. Took weeks off when I needed to, and deloads, as necessary, so overtraining wasn't an issue. So don't even bother wasting anymore time trying to fix your levels naturally. I literally tried everything under the sun. If you don't want to freeze your sperm prior to starting HRT, I would just find a doctor that will prescribe you testosterone and HCG. If you do freeze your sperm, I would recommend just starting on testosterone by itself. Either way, I would skip the clomid mono and HCG mono. Don't waste time and money on either.

 

[bochinit]

I'm younger than you, 22 years old and I'm doing TRT because I have bipolarity and this help me symptoms of depression cryses and wasting.

What I can say to you is that I don't loose fertility and many bodybilders got they wife's pregnant while on blast and cruises on many grams of steroids, and I saw some studies here on Brazil that fertility can be recovered anyways after long term steroids use..

 

[Gman86]

I'm younger than you, 22 years old and I'm doing TRT because I have bipolarity and this help me symptoms of depression cryses and wasting.

What I can say to you is that I don't loose fertility and many bodybilders got they wife's pregnant while on blast and cruises on many grams of steroids, and I saw some studies here on Brazil that fertility can be recovered anyways after long term steroids use..

Ya conception while on TRT isn’t something to be overly concerned about, imo. When women go on birth control, they are basically doing the same thing as TRT. They are introducing exogenous estrogen and progesterone, and cutting off their endogenous production, which in turn, makes them infertile. They do this for sometimes 10-20 years straight. They get off birth control, no PCT, and boom, month or two later they can get pregnant again.

I would get your free T3 and RT3 tested. Was listening to a podcast with a psychiatrist, and he said he has something like an 80% success rate with his bipolar patients with just optimizing thyroid function. He termed success as either curing them completely, or minimizing symptoms to a great extent.

Is bipolarity the same as bipolar disorder?

 

[bochinit]

Ya conception while on TRT isn’t something to be overly concerned about, imo. When women go on birth control, they are basically doing the same thing as TRT. They are introducing exogenous estrogen and progesterone, and cutting off their endogenous production, which in turn, makes them infertile. They do this for sometimes 10-20 years straight. They get off birth control, no PCT, and boom, month or two later they can get pregnant again.

I would get your free T3 and RT3 tested. Was listening to a podcast with a psychiatrist, and he said he has something like an 80% success rate with his bipolar patients with just optimizing thyroid function. He termed success as either curing them completely, or minimizing symptoms to a great extent.

Is bipolarity the same as bipolar disorder?

Bipolarity = manic-depressive condition, I read study's that TRT sems to help in depression so I realized this had benefits and can help me on my cryses of depression and avoid me to try suicide.

I started doing it by my own, since here in Brazil they don't prescribe any kind of hormonal treatments (only for transgenders, ironically).

 

[Gman86]

Bipolarity = manic-depressive condition, I read study's that TRT sems to help in depression so I realized this had benefits and can help me on my cryses of depression and avoid me to try suicide.

I started doing it by my own, since here in Brazil they don't prescribe any kind of hormonal treatments (only for transgenders, ironically).

Testosterone absolutely can help with depression. Not sure if it's true, but I've heard that testosterone therapy was one of the main treatments for depression before antidepressant medications came along. I never really had too much depression before TRT, but while on TRT, I literally have zero depression. Not even a glimpse of it once in a while.

 

[MYTVC15]

New guy here too. So if you guys don't take HCG do your balls shrink to the size of raisins? It's not so much fertility that concerns me (I'm 54) but I just don't like the idea of seeds for nuts.

To the OP - Get the book "ESTROGENERATION" by Anthony G. Jay Phd - You did everything you were supposed to health wise but it's an uphill battle as your hormones roll downhill. Just be glad you were wise enough to get a T test done. As far as depression, I'm an extremely positive person but up to the point I asked my doc for a T test it was all I could do to hold on...but then look at these numbers...

 

[bochinit]

No, my testicles do not shrink and I did not became infertile, I don't know why but I never used HCG. If your don't want more kinds I think there is no reason to use HCG. Also, some studies demonstrated that HCG can be used to restore fertiliti in bodybuilders with success after years of steroid use, so I think is reversible too.

But I don't know much about it, and majority of members use the Test + HCG protocol.

 

[whosaidthat]

New guy here too. So if you guys don't take HCG do your balls shrink to the size of raisins? It's not so much fertility that concerns me (I'm 54) but I just don't like the idea of seeds for nuts.

To the OP - Get the book "ESTROGENERATION" by Anthony G. Jay Phd - You did everything you were supposed to health wise but it's an uphill battle as your hormones roll downhill. Just be glad you were wise enough to get a T test done. As far as depression, I'm an extremely positive person but up to the point I asked my doc for a T test it was all I could do to hold on...but then look at these numbers...

Thanks for book recommendation. I'm gonna check it out tonight.

As for ball shrinkage, without hCG I've heard they shrink by about 20-30%, not to the size of raisins. Not sure about in the long term though.

 

[Gman86]

Ya I’m sure it’s different for everyone. Mine shrunk, but nothing insane. They sometimes ride higher up too, especially during orgasm. But I haven’t used HCG almost this whole year, and it hasn’t been a big deal testicular atrophy wise. Thought for sure it would be, but it’s been fine.

 

[MYTVC15]

Well, I guess I won't have to "manspread" as much. But I still will just to piss off emasculating loons out there. I suppose I can deal with like a third loss but then they say they will atrophy eventually. Not sure I like that either. Is there any particular reason you ditched the HCG?

 

[Gman86]

I personally ditched the HCG just to see how I did off of it. I haven’t noticed any differences, not even with atrophy. My testicles are the same size they were while on HCG. Since I didn’t notice any differences, I’ve just stayed off of it. I plan on eventually adding it back it at a low dose to see if I notice anything good or bad

 

[whosaidthat]

I’m starting on 200mg / week today. Will let you know how it goes