Estrogen Yo Yo

[Worried]

I am starting a new thread because the other one became too long. It has been one month now.

I started a month ago today. I have been consistent for the last two weeks with 60mg Test Cip EOD and 250iu of HCG E3D. The variable has been anastrozole. I started with .5 EOD for 10 days and tanked my E2. It went from a 16 which was my baseline to a 6 in two weeks. They told me wait a week and start .25 mg EOD. I took it one time and it gave me dry mouth, panic, chest pains, insomnia, and more.... after three days I recovered again. They told me try again next week if it did the same thing they would send me in for another e2.

I took it again and the same thing. They sent me in two days after and this time it was a 43.8 range 7.6-42.6.

The doctor and I both agree anastrozole is not for me. The second it touches my tongue I get dry mouth. So he is going to try letrozole.

Here's the thing. I realize I'm a little bit on the high side, out of range. But currently this is about the best that I've ever felt on TRT. I am strong, energetic, feeling a little froggy!! However I am having a hard time sleeping at night, no morning wood, but I am really happy that I am not in the estrogen dungeon.

Thoughts please..

 

[ERO]

If you feel good now, you may be a guy that does better with an E2 slightly above the range, which is fine. Better TRT docs treat your symptoms and how you feel rather that shooting for a specific number as that is a trip down the rabbit hole.

Interesting choice with the Letrozole as I would have thought to try Aromasin (Extremestane) instead. But of course I am not a doctor.

 

[CoastWatcher]

Why are you pathologically afraid of estradiol? It is a necessary hormone for male health. Suppressing it makes absolutely no sense. Prescribing it as a standard element of a TRT protocol is poor medical practice. Was your e2 measured on the sensitive estradiol test? Your lab report will tell you as the term sensitive or ultrasensitive will appear (the methodology is LC, MS/MS). I ask because the range you quote is suspicious and resembles the standard test. If that is the case your resulting value is unreliable and likely (though not certainly) means your actual level is lower than that. But, even if it's the right test, there is no reason in the world for you to be fearful of a result such as you posted. The upper limits are not carved in stone, I have had results that exceeded LabCorp upper limit by a reasonable bit and felt just fine.

Your doctors have practiced in a manner that causes many here to doubt their skill. The obstinate use of an AI is poor practice, they crashed your e2, they may have ordered the wrong estradiol test, your protocol is being changed after only two weeks, it takes four weeks for serum levels to become stable, you aren't being served well at all. You deserve better care.

 

[Worried]

It is listed as the Roche ECLIA methodology

 

[CoastWatcher]

It is listed as the Roche ECLIA methodology

Wrong test. Designed for women. Not reliable for men.

 

[Worried]

https://www.labcorp.com/wps/portal/?wps/poc&uri=edos:viewTestByTestNumber&testNumber=004515

 

[CoastWatcher]

https://www.labcorp.com/wps/portal/?wps/poc&uri=edos:viewTestByTestNumber&testNumber=004515

This is clearly the incorrect test. The fact that there is a range for men listed is a vestige of times past, prior to the development of the Liquid Chromatography, dual Mass Spec procedure. It's a fundamental error on your doctor's part.

 

[Worried]

Are the tests that I have been given to this point of no value? Same test shows that I started out at 16 went down to a 6 and now a 43. Not arguing the superiority of the sensitive test. I would just like to know what the numbers that I have seen to this point mean. If anything

 

[CoastWatcher]

Are the tests that I have been given to this point of no value? Same test shows that I started out at 16 went down to a 6 and now a 43. Not arguing the superiority of the sensitive test. I would just like to know what the numbers that I have seen to this point mean. If anything

I can't say. Neither could a well informed doctor. The test you had typically over reports the estradiol level when testing blood samples obtained from men and children, who have far less circulating estradiol than men do. It reads CRP in the sample as estradiol and inflates the score. Most of the time. On occasion the opposite happens. That, however, is rare. Bottom line, it's risky to make decisions based on results obtained from it.

Your estradiol was most certainly low when you got a single digit report - lower than you thought. It is likely to be lower today than you thought...not in the low 40s, but lower. All the more reason to not play roulette with an AI. You're driving in the dark.

Go to www.discountedlabs.com and self-test with the sensitive procedure. You may confirm everything to date, but as my doctor said, she just didn't trust the other test results.

 

[Worried]

I will do that and report back. I would really like to get to the point where I know what I, (and I means I) am doing. Where I am able to make my own calls. Even if it is against the doctors orders. I read my BW and know what the next step is.

 

[CoastWatcher]

I will do that and report back. I would really like to get to the point where I know what I, (and I means I) am doing. Where I am able to make my own calls. Even if it is against the doctors orders. I read my BW and know what the next step is.

I'm glad to hear you say that. We have to become our own advocates, find a doctor we can work with who treats us as a partner in these efforts and fully understands the ins and outs of testosterone/androgen management. You don't have such a doctor at this point. You deserve better.

I have had both estradiol tests run at he same time and the standard (incorrect) is always higher. Others have had both run and had the opposite happen. Rarely, they are in sync. It's just not a reliable test.