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Testosterone Replacement, Low T, HCG, & Beyond
Testosterone Basics & Questions
Does Shutting Down LH with Testosterone Have Negative Effects?
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<blockquote data-quote="Guided_by_Voices" data-source="post: 84895" data-attributes="member: 15235"><p>Some example observations:</p><p>- Regarding the original post, the idea that fluctuating T levels allow the “androgen receptors to resensitize” is contradicted by the experience of people who use much higher T levels than most on TRT. I have not paid much attention to that since it is not relevant to me, but I remember from when I was researching TRT implications that there has been much discussion of this topic and it seems that, if anything, consistently high T levels may increase the number or action of androgen receptors, just the opposite of what you claim to be true. Further, if this was an issue, we might expect to see that people required ever-increasing T replacement doses to achieve equivalent symptoms, however I do not remember seeing any reports of this from users or doctors or anyone. I suggest you go to some of the more thoughtful steroid sites and review this topic. Perhaps I am wrong, but the best evidence seems to say this is a non-issue or actually a benefit of TRT.</p><p>- I agree that lack of fluctuation might in theory be an issue (that is part of the reason I use daily Test Prop and I think Dr. Crisler likes gels for the same reason) however if it really was an issue then I would think that people on long-esters would report sleep or mood disruption, however we seem to typically see just the opposite: good sleep and improved mood. As an aside, it is hard to take the original quote seriously when it is loaded with sloppy generalizations like “countless pathways” (huh, I think the pathways are pretty well-known and counted) and “raging” T levels (my T levels are not angry at all.)</p><p>- Further, the original quote makes no attempt to acknowledge the potential advantages of steady-state levels. For me, having gone on and off TRT several times, one of the biggest benefits seems to be that I can tolerate a youthful exercise load with T levels that are not far above my “natural” levels, and I attribute this (perhaps incorrectly) to the lack of fluctuation in T. Obviously, a healthy activity level has many benefits in itself, and which I suspect for most people will far outweigh any (as yet unknown) negatives from lack of fluctuation.</p><p>- I haven't been following the thread about the 23yo, and while I agree that other things leading to a root cause fix should be investigated, I also think it is often wrong to avoid fixing the symptom while a root cause (which might never be found) is investigated. Jeopardizing a marriage or job, etc. in pursuit of the ideal fix doesn't seem like a good idea to me. </p><p>- The author of the statement in question does not suggest an alternative, and the unstated implication is that because the author has accepted a gradual decline in abilities, then everyone else should too. That, to me, is just loser-thinking, something I want to avoid, and which Will Farrell had the perfect comment on in Wedding Crashers: “What an idiot!...but hey, that just leaves more for you and me.”</p><p>- I am a big believer in remaining as natural as possible without going into decline, however Josh Mittledorf's post called “There is no such thing as Natural anti-aging” is a good read (as are all of his posts) to get some perspective on the limits of staying “natural”, since it appears that we are “naturally” pre-programmed to go into decline. So, I fully expect and am prepared to become increasingly less natural over time. Instead of worrying about having perfect “natural” T levels, I am much more focused on being grateful that we live in a time and place where we have the ability to improve our quality of life with every passing year, provided that we study and take advantage of what is available.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Guided_by_Voices, post: 84895, member: 15235"] Some example observations: - Regarding the original post, the idea that fluctuating T levels allow the “androgen receptors to resensitize” is contradicted by the experience of people who use much higher T levels than most on TRT. I have not paid much attention to that since it is not relevant to me, but I remember from when I was researching TRT implications that there has been much discussion of this topic and it seems that, if anything, consistently high T levels may increase the number or action of androgen receptors, just the opposite of what you claim to be true. Further, if this was an issue, we might expect to see that people required ever-increasing T replacement doses to achieve equivalent symptoms, however I do not remember seeing any reports of this from users or doctors or anyone. I suggest you go to some of the more thoughtful steroid sites and review this topic. Perhaps I am wrong, but the best evidence seems to say this is a non-issue or actually a benefit of TRT. - I agree that lack of fluctuation might in theory be an issue (that is part of the reason I use daily Test Prop and I think Dr. Crisler likes gels for the same reason) however if it really was an issue then I would think that people on long-esters would report sleep or mood disruption, however we seem to typically see just the opposite: good sleep and improved mood. As an aside, it is hard to take the original quote seriously when it is loaded with sloppy generalizations like “countless pathways” (huh, I think the pathways are pretty well-known and counted) and “raging” T levels (my T levels are not angry at all.) - Further, the original quote makes no attempt to acknowledge the potential advantages of steady-state levels. For me, having gone on and off TRT several times, one of the biggest benefits seems to be that I can tolerate a youthful exercise load with T levels that are not far above my “natural” levels, and I attribute this (perhaps incorrectly) to the lack of fluctuation in T. Obviously, a healthy activity level has many benefits in itself, and which I suspect for most people will far outweigh any (as yet unknown) negatives from lack of fluctuation. - I haven't been following the thread about the 23yo, and while I agree that other things leading to a root cause fix should be investigated, I also think it is often wrong to avoid fixing the symptom while a root cause (which might never be found) is investigated. Jeopardizing a marriage or job, etc. in pursuit of the ideal fix doesn't seem like a good idea to me. - The author of the statement in question does not suggest an alternative, and the unstated implication is that because the author has accepted a gradual decline in abilities, then everyone else should too. That, to me, is just loser-thinking, something I want to avoid, and which Will Farrell had the perfect comment on in Wedding Crashers: “What an idiot!...but hey, that just leaves more for you and me.” - I am a big believer in remaining as natural as possible without going into decline, however Josh Mittledorf's post called “There is no such thing as Natural anti-aging” is a good read (as are all of his posts) to get some perspective on the limits of staying “natural”, since it appears that we are “naturally” pre-programmed to go into decline. So, I fully expect and am prepared to become increasingly less natural over time. Instead of worrying about having perfect “natural” T levels, I am much more focused on being grateful that we live in a time and place where we have the ability to improve our quality of life with every passing year, provided that we study and take advantage of what is available. [/QUOTE]
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Testosterone Replacement, Low T, HCG, & Beyond
Testosterone Basics & Questions
Does Shutting Down LH with Testosterone Have Negative Effects?
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