1. #1

    New member 42 years old

    Hey all,

    New member and first time posting. I have been on TRT (test cyp 100 mg weekly) for about 2 years.

    About 6 months from my 40th birthday my marriage fell apart and I felt horrible mentally and physically. I am 6 feet tall and at the time weighed in at 345 lbs. this is the most i have ever weighed. I tried hitting the gym but had no energy and my strength was gone. I was struggling with 20 lb dumbbells when in my prime I was working out with 90 lb dumbbells. I knew something was not right. I went to my doctor and he ordered some tests and diagnosed me as hypogonadal. No brain tumors or history of testicular damage. I started on Androgel which after 3 months proved ineffective so moved to injection.

    Initial total serum test 259 ng/dl range 348 to 1197

    follow up tests
    total serum test 232 ng/dl 348 to 1197
    free test 38 pg/ml range 46 to 224

    Vit D was almost non-existent.

    It has been about 2 years and I have seen many benefits. My strength has returned and I am stronger now than I have ever been. I am down 20 lbs overall based on the scale but have filled out when it comes to musculature. I have always had broad shoulders but have gone from a 54 to a 58 and have had to throw out my suits and sports jackets. I have lost fat everywhere except my mid section. I really seem to hold on to that and am struggling there. My diet has not always been the greatest and I know I can do better there.

    Area where I have not seen improvement is erections. I can't remember the last time I had "morning wood" and erections are weak and do NOT last. Being the marriage fell apart 2 years ago sex is not plentiful so was put on the back burner to work on my mental and physical health. I would like to correct this part of my life

    I did not know about estrogen management when I started so have no baseline info so just had those levels measured last week.

    Estradiol was 50 pg/ml range < or equal to 39
    total serum estrogen 209.1 pg/ml range 60 to 190

    Total serum test 388 ng/dl 250 to 827
    free test 97.6 pg/ml range 46 to 224

    i also hold water Especially in my legs and feet and feel bloated 3 to 4 days a week.

    I am open to any advice from everyone's experience and looking forward to,learning all I can.

    thanks for listening

  2. # ADS
    Purchase From Our Affiliates
    Join Date
    Always
    Posts
    51
    Help Excelmale

    Defy
     

  3. #2
    You're being given the wrong Estrogen tests, you need the test for males, (Ultra)Sensitive, Estradiol, LC/MS/MS...this is the only test you need and this is for males. The test you received is for females and (typically) overestimates Estrogen in males.

    Bloat and water retentin those few days with your injection and tapers off at the end of the week prior to your next shot?

  4. #3
    Super Moderator Gene Devine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    South Florida
    Posts
    2,554
    Hi and welcome to Excel Male...you've come to the right place.

    First and foremost, you need to learn everything you can about TRT for men and it's all here for you to do that and why we created the site and forum.

    As far as what you posted re your blood work; your serum testosterone levels are terrible and at the bottom end of the reference range.

    Also, estrogen needs to be tested using the "Sensitive" lab and not the standard lab designed for women so it's really useless.

    Need to know what your TRT protocol is; dosages, frequency, use of HCG...

    Something is not adding up; to be on TRT and have the levels that you posted says something is wrong with what you are doing.

    Is your Doctor well trained in TRT for men...and I have a strong suspicion that's not the case or else you'd have better serum levels.

    Your erection issues can be caused by a lot of things one of which is elevated and/or suppressed estrogen levels and holding water is another red flag on elevated estrogen.

    Can you post your most recent labs here please?
    I am not a medical practitioner. Any suggestions I provide are not medical recommendations and are just my opinions. Please consult with your physician on any matters concerning your health.

  5. #4
    I'd bet he's low SHBG with those troughs

  6. #5
    Super Moderator Gene Devine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    South Florida
    Posts
    2,554
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Carter View Post
    I'd bet he's low SHBG with those troughs
    Or every two week injections!!!
    I am not a medical practitioner. Any suggestions I provide are not medical recommendations and are just my opinions. Please consult with your physician on any matters concerning your health.

  7. #6
    I inject weekly 100mgs test cyp. No hcg and no AI's. my serum levels usually are ~650. I did miss a dose in the last 3 weeks.

    SHBG was 40 when last measured. Range 27.9 to 146.0 nmol/L. This was just prior to starting on my current protocol.

    I have been working with an endocrinologist but he is not a men's health specialist.

  8. #7
    Super Moderator Gene Devine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    South Florida
    Posts
    2,554
    If you're injecting 100 mg weekly and your serum levels are test 388 ng/dl (250 to 827) free test 97.6 pg/ml range 46 to 224 then you need to increase your dosage.

    Still something seem suspect here....
    I am not a medical practitioner. Any suggestions I provide are not medical recommendations and are just my opinions. Please consult with your physician on any matters concerning your health.

  9. #8
    Hey Gene,

    thanks for for your comments. I really appreciate your time. I am not sure by what you mean by suspect?

    I did miss a dose within the last few weeks per my last post and my trough levels are usually around 650. I am guessing I am going to need a few weeks to normalize from the missed dose. Agreed 388 is not a good number.

    i have ordered the sensitive estradiol test from discounted labs and will post results once I have them and will instruct my Dr to order that test.

    Question though - how did you know my original test was not the sensitive estradiol test?

    thanks again for listening.

  10. #9
    Because of the lab ranges...the proper test has a lab value shown as <29, the test you took is < or equal to 39, we learned to know what's what by the ranges.

    By suspect I think we mean something isn't being expressed right as we know how the math typically plays out something is different with your numbers. Are you having your blood drawn in the morning, right before your due for an injection? That is the ONLY time you should be testing. Also, please do what you can, don't miss a dose, if you miss a day get back on the next day, it's very important to stay steady and consistent through your therapy.

  11. #10
    Yes. I always have blood drawn in the morning and inject after I get home.

  12. #11
    You noted that you've been on TRT for two years; do these most recent results mirror what you've posted in the past?
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

  13. #12
    Super Moderator Vettester Chris's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,580
    Mathew, thanks for signing up with EM! Great comments above! The only thing I might add is if you can post a complete set of labs (scan image is fine), with CBC's, lipids, metabolic, thyroid, etc., the forum will have more to discuss, plus there could be other factors for talking points that might be relevant to your current situation?
    Please, no PM's posting lab results ... Let's Keep them on the Open Forum for Everyone to Comment. Feel free to PM me a link to your thread if you would like me to comment. Thanks!!


    I am not a Doctor, I only play one on T.V. Please consult your physician, or a trained-licensed physician before proceeding with any comments or suggestions posted on this or any forum.


  14. #13
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    South Jersey
    Posts
    47

    Post

    Here are my latest labs as requested.

    I also have have my results for the sensitive estradiol from discounted labs. 63.6 pg/ml range 8 to 35.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  15. #14
    Super Moderator Vettester Chris's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,580
    Hi Matt, thanks for getting back and posting the labs. Real quick, you setup two (2) memberships, one under Matt, one under Mathew. If there's a problem with your first account that your originally posted, please let myself or one of our other staff members know, thanks!

    Triglycerides are quite high as you know. Is there anything immediate in your diet that you can attribute this to? Sugars, high carbs??

    RBC's and HCT is just starting to get to the outside of reference range. Would be good to look into donating blood.

    Total test is LOW for 100mg/wk. Were you on your TRT protocol when drawing these labs? Do you remember when your last draw was in relation to these labs (1 hour, 1 day, 7 days?)

    PSA is excellent!!

    Both estradiol assays are high. To really gauge the accuracy of measurement we need to see this on a Sensitive or Ultra-Sensitive platform. I honestly believe that will register "High" as well, but trying to set a program and goal to manage your serum levels will be significantly easier, and more successful with an assay designed for adult males.

    Vitamin D at 42ng/ml ... IMO, optimal Vitamin D serum levels will be achieved somewhere in the 60 to 80 range. 5,000iu/day usually put me at 75 on the last labs. You could also talk to your physician about Drisdol, which I initially did 1x/week for about 6 weeks, then my doctor just had me on OTC D3.

    Not seeing anything on thyroid ... Need Free T3, Free T4, Reverse T3, TSH and antibodes, TPO & TgAb. Iron serum, TIBC, ferritin, B12. Also, DHEA at 141 is quite low, but I would do ANYTHING in this area until you get your E2 under control. This could also be a marker for other imbalances in the adrenals; possibly in a maladaptation phase ... All just speculation, but a 24 hour saliva kit with Cortisol and DHEA correlation will tell the story on your circadian profile.

    Just saw TSH
    , one would expect the other primary thyroid labs would be in the optimal zone, if only the TSH by itself had any reliability. I've seen females with estrogen dominance that have severe hypothyroidism, meaning in the tank, below reference range on FT4 and FT3, and their TSH is < 1.0. I suspect that actual active thyroid hormone levels are going to be low, and/or pooling can be problematic when iron is off, adrenals are off, and even some of the electrolytes and D3 can play into this.
    Please, no PM's posting lab results ... Let's Keep them on the Open Forum for Everyone to Comment. Feel free to PM me a link to your thread if you would like me to comment. Thanks!!


    I am not a Doctor, I only play one on T.V. Please consult your physician, or a trained-licensed physician before proceeding with any comments or suggestions posted on this or any forum.


  16. #15
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    South Jersey
    Posts
    47

    Post

    Hi Chris,

    Thanks for you comments.

    I have have a second account I am using because my original account "Matthew Leiser" sign in was via Facebook and it is now not working.

    For the triglycerides, I have to relate that to my diet. It had too many sugars, not enough fiber. I have corrected both of those items. Nelson had posted links to Dr Robert Lustig's videos and it clicked with me. It was tough for the first 3 to 4 days but now I don't even miss the sugar. I crave the protein and vegetables.

    I am am due to give blood. I did not know about the higher crit on trt until joining this forum. It is always something I like to do at least once a year.

    My serum T was low this draw as I missed a dose a few weeks back at the beginning of march. I went almost 2 weeks without dosing and was starting to feel like I used to and then suspected I had missed a dose. I did not alter dosage just dosed and then moved my injection days to Friday mornings. My last labs were prob about 6+ months ago. I would need to go back and look it up.

    I have had the sensitive e2 test and the results are attached. I am almost twice the highest range.

    I take Vit D3 5000iu per day plus another 600 in my multivitamin. I was on 50000 d2 for a few weeks in 2015 until things normalized. I was thinking of possibly upping but it is Baseball season and I am coaching so may wait and measure it again in about a month after opening day.

    Will LL look more at thyroid hx at a different time. Lunch break is over.

    Thanks again,

    Matt
    Attached Images Attached Images

  17. #16
    Are you dealing with symptoms associated with elevated estradiol? That is an elevated value, no question.
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

  18. #17
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    South Jersey
    Posts
    47
    Yes. Libido is really low, no morning wood ever and erections are soft and don't last. I also retain water especially in my legs and feet.

  19. #18
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    South Jersey
    Posts
    47
    In addition my endocrinologist has reported the onset of gyno. 3 cm on left, 2 cm in the right.

  20. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Leiser View Post
    In addition my endocrinologist has reported the onset of gyno. 3 cm on left, 2 cm in the right.
    Has an AI been prescribed? When gynecomastia is confirmed, a prompt response leads to the best outcome.
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

  21. #20
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    South Jersey
    Posts
    47
    No AI as of yet. I have an appointment tomorrow to discuss.

  22. #21
    You're running 62 on the E2 test I would recommend .25mg E3.5D, I would be wary of any more than that, would be better to go slow there, labs in 4 weeks and then adjust if needed with symptoms.

  23. #22
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    South Jersey
    Posts
    47
    Met with Dr today. I am now on Arimidex. Starting .25 mg twice a week. Will redo labs in 1 month. I'm a bit nervous with this drug. What can I expect other than reduction in E2? Would love to hear your experiences and will research later in other threads when done work

  24. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Leiser View Post
    Met with Dr today. I am now on Arimidex. Starting .25 mg twice a week. Will redo labs in 1 month. I'm a bit nervous with this drug. What can I expect other than reduction in E2? Would love to hear your experiences and will research later in other threads when done work
    I have never taken an AI, I lowered my estradiol, it had reached 55/sensitive, through dose manipulation. But it's certainly prudent for you and your doctor to add it to your protocol, particularly in light of the gynecomastia that has presented. It's a modest, appropriate dose that has been prescribed.
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

  25. #24
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Los Angeles Area
    Posts
    238
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Leiser View Post
    Met with Dr today. I am now on Arimidex. Starting .25 mg twice a week. Will redo labs in 1 month. I'm a bit nervous with this drug. What can I expect other than reduction in E2? Would love to hear your experiences and will research later in other threads when done work
    I can understand the nervousness about the AI. Personal experience has made me cautious too. Fortunately I don't need an AI or take one, but you seem to have both symptoms and labs which point to the possibility that an AI will help you. I'll be interested to learn how it goes for you!

  26. #25
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    South Jersey
    Posts
    47
    I am 3 days in to taking Arimidex. I will have my second dose mid day tomorrow. I felt ok with the first dose. What I did notice is after a few hours I was bone tired. A tired I have not felt in a long time. I was out cold by 8 pm Friday night. It did not carry over to Saturday. I am interested to see if I feel the same with the next dose. The only other things I noticed was my face and ears felt flushed and an increase in urination pretty much all weekend.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. New Member - 10 Years on TRT, Now Dealing With Problems
    By Mrchuck2000 in forum Testosterone Basics & Questions
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 01-22-2017, 06:38 AM
  2. New Member - 10 Years on TRT, Now Dealing With Problems
    By Mrchuck2000 in forum Introductions
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 01-21-2017, 04:00 PM
  3. New Member 25 Years Old With Low T
    By jackass69 in forum Introductions
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 04-28-2016, 07:53 PM
  4. new member fired my DR of 15 years yesterday.
    By bako in forum Introductions
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 04-03-2016, 02:24 PM
  5. New Member looking for opinions on bloods. 26 years old.
    By happyh26 in forum Blood Test Discussion
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 03-30-2016, 09:07 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •