So who is happy with TRT? Who wish they never started?

[Rolo]

Hi,
As someone with a total T of 230 at 42 years old. And reading these boards as well as numerous research articles. Who is ultimately happy with going on TRT? What benefits did you see? What negatives did you personally see? Its hard to really discern whether the benefits outweighs the risks etc. How is everyone's libido? What ester are you on and how much/how often?

Just trying to get some feedback from people currently on TRT or that were on and went off due to side effects.

I’ve been using it for about a year and I haven’t had any “bad” side effects. I see that I maintain muscle mass better, I was scribbling up and my skin is better too. How’s the libido ? Well I am older so I noticed my sex drive has increased a lot, now as far as erection I will use a Sildenafil pill and can have sex for hours! And man I’m hard as a rock! I’m only using 5mil of testosterone (1wk)and Clomiphene Citrate(2wk) I also notice my loads are wayy bigger than before! Before testosterone it seemed to be running out, just drops. Now it’s like I’m in my prime ya know!! I am making the best of it, having a lot of adult fun!! I am so glad I got on it! Go for it you only live once, might as well enjoy it !!!

 

[HyperResponder]

I’ve been on TRT 5 years. If I could undo one mistake in my life it would be to never walk into that Low T clinic. I’ve tried every combination of things but as soon as I go above my body’s natural test level, my E skyrockets. Worst part is that I’m an AI hyper-responder (See screen name, lol). For me the E balance has been impossible. I’ve tried diluting the AI to a tiny fraction of the dose and it still causes crazy anxiety and sore joints. I haven’t taken an AI in years. Even Cialis will tank my E (I’m sure to get a lot of shit for that statement) but that is my AI at this point. I tried allowing the E to go low and supplementing with DHEA but it wasn’t a match. HCG wasn’t a huge help but I take it anyway.

I think my tinkering mindset and anxiety make me exactly the kind of person who struggles on TRT. I think I’m ultimately using all of these tools to try and control sex and anxiety. Before TRT I had regular person anxiety, now I have anxiety I funnel into TRT.

So I can firmly say that I regret it. I didn’t calculate that my temperament would be totally hooked by it. And now it is WAY too late to step back.

 

[Gman86]

I’ve been on TRT 5 years. If I could undo one mistake in my life it would be to never walk into that Low T clinic. I’ve tried every combination of things but as soon as I go above my body’s natural test level, my E skyrockets. Worst part is that I’m an AI hyper-responder (See screen name, lol). For me the E balance has been impossible. I’ve tried diluting the AI to a tiny fraction of the dose and it still causes crazy anxiety and sore joints. I haven’t taken an AI in years. Even Cialis will tank my E (I’m sure to get a lot of shit for that statement) but that is my AI at this point. I tried allowing the E to go low and supplementing with DHEA but it wasn’t a match. HCG wasn’t a huge help but I take it anyway.

I think my tinkering mindset and anxiety make me exactly the kind of person who struggles on TRT. I think I’m ultimately using all of these tools to try and control sex and anxiety. Before TRT I had regular person anxiety, now I have anxiety I funnel into TRT.

So I can firmly say that I regret it. I didn’t calculate that my temperament would be totally hooked by it. And now it is WAY too late to step back.

Sorry to hear that u’ve struggled so much. But definitely don’t give up, and don’t give up hope. U still have options that u haven’t explored yet. I used to have issues dialing in E2 when using AI’s as well. I know a lot of DHT derivatives are unfortunately not legal to prescribe in the U.S., but I’ve done much better using DHT derivatives such as primobolan and proviron to control E2 and prolactin

Another option would be to use a nandrolone based protocol. It’s an excellent option for guys that struggle with E2 and prolactin issues, imo. Use nandrolone as ur base, which provides most of the androgens that u need, and then use a very low dose of testosterone to provide enough E2. Instead of using an ai on a test based protocol, and trying to lower E2, u basically use testosterone to increase E2 to where u feel ur best.

Either way, don’t give up or lose hope. U can absolutely feel great on HRT. Everyone can. U just have to continue experimenting to figure out what works best for u. If u continue trial and erroring the same things, it’s unlikely that ur going to feel optimal anytime soon. Sometimes u have to think outside the box

I’ve said it before on here, but even the PA that I do my 6 month consults with at my clinic has adopted a nandrolone based protocol. He’s been on it for about 3 years now. He says he prefers it over using a test based protocol with small doses of AI’s. I brought it up to him when I wanted to try it a few years ago, and he was ok with me giving it a go. And when he saw me have success with it, he tried it himself, and ended up liking it better than a test based protocol, and has been on it ever since

 

[HyperResponder]

Sorry to hear that u’ve struggled so much. But definitely don’t give up, and don’t give up hope. U still have options that u haven’t explored yet. I used to have issues dialing in E2 when using AI’s as well. I know a lot of DHT derivatives are unfortunately not legal to prescribe in the U.S., but I’ve done much better using DHT derivatives such as primobolan and proviron to control E2 and prolactin

Another option would be to use a nandrolone based protocol. It’s an excellent option for guys that struggle with E2 and prolactin issues, imo. Use nandrolone as ur base, which provides most of the androgens that u need, and then use a very low dose of testosterone to provide enough E2. Instead of using an ai on a test based protocol, and trying to lower E2, u basically use testosterone to increase E2 to where u feel ur best.

Either way, don’t give up or lose hope. U can absolutely feel great on HRT. Everyone can. U just have to continue experimenting to figure out what works best for u. If u continue trial and erroring the same things, it’s unlikely that ur going to feel optimal anytime soon. Sometimes u have to think outside the box

I’ve said it before on here, but even the PA that I do my 6 month consults with at my clinic has adopted a nandrolone based protocol. He’s been on it for about 3 years now. He says he prefers it over using a test based protocol with small doses of AI’s. I brought it up to him when I wanted to try it a few years ago, and he was ok with me giving it a go. And when he saw me have success with it, he tried it himself, and ended up liking it better than a test based protocol, and has been on it ever since

Thank you for this. I’ve never really considered a Nandrolone based protocol. I always saw guys on here talking about it and it seemed like a big departure from the standard wisdom. But like you said, time to think out of the box.
There is no giving up here. I did try to come off TRT during the pandemic lockdowns and it wasn’t an option. Those 6 weeks were really bad. Best thing to do is to keep moving forward and trying the best I can. I’ll look into this you suggest.

 

[tropicaldaze1950]

Sorry to hear that u’ve struggled so much. But definitely don’t give up, and don’t give up hope. U still have options that u haven’t explored yet. I used to have issues dialing in E2 when using AI’s as well. I know a lot of DHT derivatives are unfortunately not legal to prescribe in the U.S., but I’ve done much better using DHT derivatives such as primobolan and proviron to control E2 and prolactin

Another option would be to use a nandrolone based protocol. It’s an excellent option for guys that struggle with E2 and prolactin issues, imo. Use nandrolone as ur base, which provides most of the androgens that u need, and then use a very low dose of testosterone to provide enough E2. Instead of using an ai on a test based protocol, and trying to lower E2, u basically use testosterone to increase E2 to where u feel ur best.

Either way, don’t give up or lose hope. U can absolutely feel great on HRT. Everyone can. U just have to continue experimenting to figure out what works best for u. If u continue trial and erroring the same things, it’s unlikely that ur going to feel optimal anytime soon. Sometimes u have to think outside the box

I’ve said it before on here, but even the PA that I do my 6 month consults with at my clinic has adopted a nandrolone based protocol. He’s been on it for about 3 years now. He says he prefers it over using a test based protocol with small doses of AI’s. I brought it up to him when I wanted to try it a few years ago, and he was ok with me giving it a go. And when he saw me have success with it, he tried it himself, and ended up liking it better than a test based protocol, and has been on it ever since

Nandrolone in place of testosterone? Though I read your posts, I don't recall them in detail. 10 years on and off for me with rx testosterone and the closest I've found to a degree of consistency was when I was doing 100 mg E5D. Right now, because of my prescription of .5 ml per week, doing 30 mg SuTTh. See my urologist in December.

 

[Gman86]

Nandrolone in place of testosterone? Though I read your posts, I don't recall them in detail. 10 years on and off for me with rx testosterone and the closest I've found to a degree of consistency was when I was doing 100 mg E5D. Right now, because of my prescription of .5 ml per week, doing 30 mg SuTTh. See my urologist in December.

Ya nandrolone can replace testosterone as a base. At HRT dosages it just doesn’t produce enough E2 for most guys. So in the dosages we would take on HRT u would just need to add in something that produces a decent amount of E2. That‘s where adding in the minimum effective dose of test comes in. Back in Arnold’s day, nandrolone was the preferred AAS, not test. They didn’t use AI’s back then, so test would cause a ton of side effects at the dosages they needed. So a lot of guys used high doses of nandrolone. Nandrolone converts into estrogen, just at a much lower rate than test. So if u use huge bodybuilding dosages of it, it’s enough to use it by itself, since there will be enough estrogen in ur system. But with low HRT dosages, its just not enough nandrolone to create enough estrogen on its own

When I did a nandrolone based protocol, I kept my nandrolone dose the same the entire year, which was 200mg/ week, and started with 40mg of test, and titrated all the way up to 100mg of test. I think my sweet spot ended up being 40-60mg of test, with the 200mg of deca. I’ll also share the protocol that the PA at my clinic uses. And I’ll also link a YouTube vid. It’s obv about steroid cycles, but if u go to 34 mins in, the guy talks about using nandrolone by itself, and all the benefits he noticed over using other AAS, including test. He says that nandrolone just makes him feel way more in control of all his emotions. This is common to hear when guys switch over to a nandrolone base. They usually report feeling more calm, cool and collected. I can also report feeling the same when I was using a nandrolone base

PA’s protocol:
140 deca
35 test cyp
-does daily subQ injections for both deca and test. Draws and injects with 30 gauge syringe. Draws up both in same syringe
-if no morning wood, will skip test shot, and E2 will come down and morning wood comes right back

 

[HSLD]

Ya nandrolone can replace testosterone as a base. At HRT dosages it just doesn’t produce enough E2 for most guys. So in the dosages we would take on hrt u would just need to add in something that reproduces a decent amount of E2. That‘s where adding in the minimum effective dose of test comes in. Back in Arnold’s day, nandrolone was the preferred AAS, not test. They didn’t use AI’s back then, so test would cause a ton of side effects at the dosages they needed. So a lot of guys used high doses of nandrolone. Nandrolone converts into estrogen, just at a much lower rate than test. So if u use huge bodybuilding dosages of it, it’s enough to use it by itself, since there will be enough estrogen in ur system. But with low HRT dosages, its just not enough nandrolone to create enough estrogen on its own

When I did a nandrolone based protocol, I kept my nandrolone dose the same the entire year, which was 200mg/ week, and started with 40mg of test, and titrated all the way up to 100mg of test. I think my sweet spot ended up being 40-60mg of test, with the 200mg of deca. I’ll also share the protocol that the PA at my clinic uses. And I’ll also link a YouTube vid. It’s obv about steroid cycles, but if u go to 34 mins in, the guy talks about using nandrolone by itself, and all the benefits he noticed over using other AAS, including test. He says that nandrolone just makes him feel way more in control of all his emotions. This is common to hear when guys switch over to a nandrolone base. They usually report feeling more calm, cool and collected. I can also report feeling the same when I was using a nandrolone base

PA’s protocol:
140 deca
35 test cyp
-does daily subQ injections for both deca and test. Draws and injects with 30 gauge syringe. Draws up both in same syringe
-if no morning wood, will skip test shot, and E2 will come down and morning wood comes right back

Appreciate you sharing your experiences with this. I've seen you mention it here in the past as well. Interesting to hear that some guys switching to the nandrolone based protocol report feeling their emotions are more stable, as when nandrolone is added to a test based protocol, the exact opposite often occurs.

I saw that you mentioned you are using proviron, etc in addition to nandrolone and test. Do you happen to have labs showing your DHT levels on a nandrolone based protocol with low dose test from when you weren't using any DHT derivatives?

 

[tropicaldaze1950]

Ya nandrolone can replace testosterone as a base. At HRT dosages it just doesn’t produce enough E2 for most guys. So in the dosages we would take on hrt u would just need to add in something that reproduces a decent amount of E2. That‘s where adding in the minimum effective dose of test comes in. Back in Arnold’s day, nandrolone was the preferred AAS, not test. They didn’t use AI’s back then, so test would cause a ton of side effects at the dosages they needed. So a lot of guys used high doses of nandrolone. Nandrolone converts into estrogen, just at a much lower rate than test. So if u use huge bodybuilding dosages of it, it’s enough to use it by itself, since there will be enough estrogen in ur system. But with low HRT dosages, its just not enough nandrolone to create enough estrogen on its own

When I did a nandrolone based protocol, I kept my nandrolone dose the same the entire year, which was 200mg/ week, and started with 40mg of test, and titrated all the way up to 100mg of test. I think my sweet spot ended up being 40-60mg of test, with the 200mg of deca. I’ll also share the protocol that the PA at my clinic uses. And I’ll also link a YouTube vid. It’s obv about steroid cycles, but if u go to 34 mins in, the guy talks about using nandrolone by itself, and all the benefits he noticed over using other AAS, including test. He says that nandrolone just makes him feel way more in control of all his emotions. This is common to hear when guys switch over to a nandrolone base. They usually report feeling more calm, cool and collected. I can also report feeling the same when I was using a nandrolone base

PA’s protocol:
140 deca
35 test cyp
-does daily subQ injections for both deca and test. Draws and injects with 30 gauge syringe. Draws up both in same syringe
-if no morning wood, will skip test shot, and E2 will come down and morning wood comes right back

Thank you!

 

[Ricko Steamboat]

My test was 25, free 375, but I was always tired and my libido had dropped of a cliff, doc put me on a high dose and straight away I was the exact opposite, more positive more energy, a ton better libido etc, been now for 5 months and still going well although I’m still dialing in. In the beginning I shot up to 1300 test which was from my understanding anabolic range, which I never wanted, started aromatizing so was put in Anastrozole which I took once and then I started cutting back, doctor wanted me to stay high and keep taking the AI but I never took another one and dropped down to 100mg a week now my test is 671, doing every 4th day, I’m going to go to pinning every 3rd day and see if I can tweak it up a little as the honeymoon is over…..sometimes I feel a tinge of anxiety, not sure

 

[Systemlord]

been now for 5 months and still going well although I’m still dialing in.

I feel for you guys still dialing in on injections.

Jatenzo recommended starting dosage 237 mg, twice daily, steady state in 7 days, done and optimized!

Still on the same protocol for years. My hormones levels have a consistency I’ve never encountered before. 100 ng/dL drop every hour and I can easily predict where my levels are in a given hour, only I feel the same 24/7!

 

[Arcane]

I started it at 33yo, I wish I had waited or never did it. 20+ years of sticks is not enjoyable. I am switching to the new oral one and see if that works at all.

dang. only issue is the needles?

 

[Systemlord]

Yeah 20+ years of weekly jabs is tiresome lol

Some members I are on daily shots, lol!

 

[HSLD]

Some members I are on daily shots, lol!

Would ya believe I actually like my shots?

I look forward to it as part of a regular ritual like a cup of coffee in the morning.

 

[aneuman]

Would ya believe I actually like my shots?

I look forward to it as part of a regular ritual like a cup of coffee in the morning.

Actually, I do believe you.

 

[Systemlord]

Would ya believe I actually like my shots?

Let us know how you feel after 20 years.

 

[CKO]

When I did a nandrolone based protocol, I kept my nandrolone dose the same the entire year, which was 200mg/ week, and started with 40mg of test, and titrated all the way up to 100mg of test. I think my sweet spot ended up being 40-60mg of test, with the 200mg of deca. I’ll also share the protocol that the PA at my clinic uses. And I’ll also link a YouTube vid. It’s obv about steroid cycles, but if u go to 34 mins in, the guy talks about using nandrolone by itself, and all the benefits he noticed over using other AAS, including test. He says that nandrolone just makes him feel way more in control of all his emotions. This is common to hear when guys switch over to a nandrolone base. They usually report feeling more calm, cool and collected. I can also report feeling the same when I was using a nandrolone

GMan, I didn't realize you used a nandrolone base. I guess I hadn't seen you comment on it in a while. It's actually pretty interesting that you've made it work for you and you respond well to it. Are you still using it? Nandrolone is pretty polarizing, it either works great or it's pretty awful. The negatives for some include: ED, mental health changes (anxiety, irrational thinking or obsessing), increased prolactin, and hct generally goes up. It's been great for my joints but it definitely messes with my head. I haven't been able to stay on it.

 

[Arcane]

Yeah 20+ years of weekly jabs is tiresome lol

Give the new stuff a try, worst case, go back to the sticks.

Otherwise feeling good?

 

[Arcane]

Would ya believe I actually like my shots?

I look forward to it as part of a regular ritual like a cup of coffee in the morning.

How long have you been on?

 

[HyperResponder]

GMan, I didn't realize you used a nandrolone base. I guess I hadn't seen you comment on it in a while. It's actually pretty interesting that you've made it work for you and you respond well to it. Are you still using it? Nandrolone is pretty polarizing, it either works great or it's pretty awful. The negatives for some include: ED, mental health changes (anxiety, irrational thinking or obsessing), increased prolactin, and hct generally goes up. It's been great for my joints but it definitely messes with my head. I haven't been able to stay on it.

Do you mind sharing what kind of protocol you were using? A lot of people start with a Test base and add a little Nandrolone. This seems to make people have a really hard time. Others on forums talk about starting with Nandrolone only and then adding enough Test to aromatize to meet their Estrogen needs. Nandrolone on its own doesn’t aromatize to estrogen or DHT. The YouTuber “plates not dates” even did the protocol without T entirely but had to supplement with estrogen gel to keep his E up.

Some of this could be internet rumor, or different outcomes for different bodies. How did you go about using Nandrolone?

 

[Gman86]

Thank you for this. I’ve never really considered a Nandrolone based protocol. I always saw guys on here talking about it and it seemed like a big departure from the standard wisdom. But like you said, time to think out of the box.
There is no giving up here. I did try to come off TRT during the pandemic lockdowns and it wasn’t an option. Those 6 weeks were really bad. Best thing to do is to keep moving forward and trying the best I can. I’ll look into this you suggest.

Glad that u have this no quit attitude. I promise u that u will eventually figure out a protocol that works great for u. As long as u don’t give up, and are always up to try new things, and think outside the box, if needed, u will 100% figure it out. The only guys that don’t ever figure out how to feel good on HRT are the guys that give up, and/ or the guys that aren’t willing to think outside the box and use approaches that aren’t the norm. In this HRT game u have to be open to any and all possibilities/ options. And u have to be willing to trial and error new approaches. Nothing will ever change if u don’t implement change. U do the same things, expect the same results