Thread: Starting Clomid

  1. #1

    Starting Clomid

    TL;DR...hit my head in 2013, testosterone is in the tank, starting clomid hoping for a restart.

    I had my consult with Dr. Saya last week. I'm 44 y.o. and have had two tests showing very low testosterone. My symptoms began in 2013 after a cycling incident. I was traveling down a 10ft wide cycling/walking trail. As I was passing some walkers their dog walked right into my path. As I veered to avoid the dog my wheels dropped off the trail and this sent me off the bike at around 12 to 15mph head first into the pavement. I hit might right temple first and my helmet broke like it was supposed to. If not for my helmet, I'm fairly certain this would have gone from a concussion to a more severe TBI. The combination of my wheels getting trapped on the edge of the pavement and being clipped into my pedals probably caused me to land head first. Trails are dangerous, I'd rather ride on the open road.

    I recovered from the concussion in a few weeks but noticed a gradual downward spiral in my overall mood and sense of well being. At first I was thinking this must be some sort of mid life crisis. However, as the months/years went by I kept noticing I didn't feel right.

    In May of 2016 I visited my dr and told him I suspected my testosterone levels may be off. He ordered a total T and TSH test. The next day his nurse called and said my T level was fine so I didn't think much about it. A few months later I obtained my medical records from this doctor, for other reasons, and noticed the lab results. The testosterone was 149ng/dl with a lab reference range of 132 - 820! Obviously, my testosterone was "in range" so everything was deemed to be ok by my doctor.

    I have Clomid in route as of today and will be starting it this week. I hope it can restart my natural testosterone production. I'm unsure if Clomid is a long term solution, assuming I'm still capable of producing testosterone, but I'm willing to be a forum unicorn.

    I guess my main question is, will Clomid still stimulate natural testosterone even if there is some sort of disconnect between the hypothalamus/pituitary axis? At first I was under the impression that Clomid is an analog to LH, but after some reading I'm not sure if that's the case.
    Last edited by hva; 02-06-2017 at 10:33 AM.

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  3. #2
    You've got nothing to lose by doing a trial run.I'm a week in to clomid 12.5 daily.Everything is up,literally,libido,energy,etc.

  4. #3
    That's good to hear. My pharma package is currently out for delivery so I'll be starting it today.

  5. #4
    Moderator Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hva View Post
    That's good to hear. My pharma package is currently out for delivery so I'll be starting it today.
    Dr Says is great TRT doctor, so I know you're in good hands, keep us updated.
    I am not a medical practitioner. Any suggestions I provide are not medical recommendations and are just my opinions. Please consult with your physician on any matters concerning your health.

  6. #5
    This morning I took my third 12.5mg dose of Clomid. I'm really trying to avoid any thoughts of placebo but I honestly feel like some of the brain fog has lifted ever so slightly. Dr. Saya also prescribed 30mg DHEA and I've noted much deeper sleep after taking it an hour before bed.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by hva View Post
    This morning I took my third 12.5mg dose of Clomid. I'm really trying to avoid any thoughts of placebo but I honestly feel like some of the brain fog has lifted ever so slightly. Dr. Saya also prescribed 30mg DHEA and I've noted much deeper sleep after taking it an hour before bed.
    To hear you're feeling better is great news, but keep your focus on the long term. Almost all of us, be it Clomid or traditional TRT, experience ups and downs (sometimes significant ones) as the journey unfolds. All the best.
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

  8. #7
    At this point it's probably the better sleep more than anything. I've had this vicious cycle of low T, poor sleep, brain fog, extreme mental fatigue followed by more poor sleep.

  9. #8
    Morning wood is making an appearance. I'm starting to notice my forehead and shoulders are oily like they used to be. I've had unusually dry skin for the past two or three years. Honestly, I think this is working. If I had some spare time I would get some blood work done right now just out of curiosity.

  10. #9
    It's been a little over a week with 12.5mg ED Clomid. I'm half way through my third pill. Subjectively, my low T symptoms have vanished and I feel like I did 20 years ago. My wife can objectively say things have improved. I honestly didn't think this would have much of an improvement in a week.

  11. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by hva View Post
    It's been a little over a week with 12.5mg ED Clomid. I'm half way through my third pill. Subjectively, my low T symptoms have vanished and I feel like I did 20 years ago. My wife can objectively say things have improved. I honestly didn't think this would have much of an improvement in a week.
    A great and encouraging response thus far.

    Will be very interested to see first round of follow-up labs which will offer more insight, keeping in mind the longterm goal.
    Lead Physician & Medical Director
    www.defymedical.com

    NOTE: Comments on this forum are NOT medical advice and are no substitute for individualized patient care. Comments on this forum do not constitute or establish a physician-patient relationship. Please consult your personal physician prior to initiating or changing ANY treatment regimen.

  12. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Justin Saya, MD View Post
    A great and encouraging response thus far.

    Will be very interested to see first round of follow-up labs which will offer more insight, keeping in mind the longterm goal.
    Is it even plausible that benefits are felt from the increase in testosterone that fast? From my understanding, most of the major effects are genomic actions which generally take weeks to maybe 2 months to reach a noticable, perceivable level. There are the non-genomic effects though, such as those mediated via GPR30, so it could be that.

    Either way, OP congrats on feeling better!

  13. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by johndoesmith View Post
    Is it even plausible that benefits are felt from the increase in testosterone that fast? From my understanding, most of the major effects are genomic actions which generally take weeks to maybe 2 months to reach a noticable, perceivable level. There are the non-genomic effects though, such as those mediated via GPR30, so it could be that.

    Either way, OP congrats on feeling better!
    Most subjective results indeed take time, however many men do seem to notice subjective changes (sometimes positive, sometimes negative) sooner than expected...and the incidence of this is much higher than can likely be explained by placebo effect.

    For Clomid specifically we can think of possible peripheral/central actions (known and unknown) of the gonadotropins (LH/FSH) and for both Clomid/TRT we can think of possible areas such as endorphin release, nitric oxide production, up/down receptor regulation, neurotransmitter balancing, etc. Again, most generally take some time, but the human body is an amazing specimen.
    Lead Physician & Medical Director
    www.defymedical.com

    NOTE: Comments on this forum are NOT medical advice and are no substitute for individualized patient care. Comments on this forum do not constitute or establish a physician-patient relationship. Please consult your personal physician prior to initiating or changing ANY treatment regimen.

  14. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Justin Saya, MD View Post
    Most subjective results indeed take time, however many men do seem to notice subjective changes (sometimes positive, sometimes negative) sooner than expected...and the incidence of this is much higher than can likely be explained by placebo effect.

    For Clomid specifically we can think of possible peripheral/central actions (known and unknown) of the gonadotropins (LH/FSH) and for both Clomid/TRT we can think of possible areas such as endorphin release, nitric oxide production, up/down receptor regulation, neurotransmitter balancing, etc. Again, most generally take some time, but the human body is an amazing specimen.
    There is so much I don't know. I didn't even consider the LH/FSH effects.

    What about the estrogen agonism of zuclomiphene? If OP was low E2, that could have an effect that's positive.

    I often think about the estrogen antagonism causing some of the negative effects of clomid.

    You most certainly have a point, that the incidence of people reporting effects quickly is too high to be placebo, but some part of me just finds it to be incorrect, I can't exactly articulate a scientific reason(other than what I stated) so it might just be "broscience". I digress.

  15. #14
    My E2 was on the low side as well as DHEA. I started taking some OTC DHEA the same day as my consult and it was about a week before the Clomid arrived.

    I've been mindful of the potential placebo effect. However, the onset of oily skin and even some acne are two things I know cannot be anything other than a return to normal for me and they came back very soon.

    I should also mention I've struggled with keeping hypertension under control and it's been much more difficult to keep within range after the low T symptoms began. The day after my consult with Dr Saya I saw my PCP and he started me on 12.5mg Atonolol ED. This definitely has had a calming effect and brought me back down to 125/75. It is also keeping my resting heart rate at around 70 and not 90 like before.

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