Crashed E2 - Recovery Time and Symptoms

johndoesmith said:

Why did you change protocols if it worked well?

Yes, if you stop AI, give it 4-6 weeks.

I'd stop the AI.

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When I had crashed E2 and stopped taking the AI, the worst symptoms began to fade after a week but lingered for 4 weeks. It was 2 months before E2 came back into a good range and I felt good again.

That's just one anecdotal account, but gives you some idea of the time frame. I'm sure the E2 recovery period is affected by many variables, including your TRT protocol, how badly you crashed, body fat level, nutrition, supplements, exercise level, and so on.

Leesto said:

When I had crashed E2 and stopped taking the AI, the worst symptoms began to fade after a week but lingered for 4 weeks. It was 2 months before E2 came back into a good range and I felt good again.

That's just one anecdotal account, but gives you some idea of the time frame. I'm sure the E2 recovery period is affected by many variables, including your TRT protocol, how badly you crashed, body fat level, nutrition, supplements, exercise level, and so on.

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How long until your E2 level according to lab tests, was at a decent level?

Or at least, since I assume you weren't checking too often, when was the first lab test that wasn't crashed?

Low e2 is the worst. WAY WAY worse than high e2. Numerous of us have been there and it will take time. Take CW's advice and continue on without an AI for at least 6 weeks before retesting. IME, even after e2 comes back up, it can still take a few weeks to feel good again. Your body needs to maintain balance for a bit before you will begin to feel better.

See my thread here on how miniscule amounts of AI affected my e2 levels.
https://www.excelmale.com/forum/sho...te-to-my-e2-(AI)-experiment&p=59084#post59084

johndoesmith said:

How long until your E2 level according to lab tests, was at a decent level?

Or at least, since I assume you weren't checking too often, when was the first lab test that wasn't crashed?

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johndoesmith the next lab test was at 6 weeks and it was 32.5 E2 Sensitive. It was 8 weeks though before I really felt good again. Go figure. Maybe E2 has to be in a good range for a period of days or weeks to fully counter the effects of a crash? Just speculating here.

Leesto said:

johndoesmith the next lab test was at 6 weeks and it was 32.5 E2 Sensitive. It was 8 weeks though before I really felt good again. Go figure. Maybe E2 has to be in a good range for a period of days or weeks to fully counter the effects of a crash? Just speculating here.

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So at 6 weeks you measured E2, and 2 weeks later you felt better, or an additional 8 weeks after the E2 test?

I believe it's due to E2's effects being mediated mostly by nuclear receptors as opposed to G-coupled protein receptors, such as caffeine which elicits its effects via GCPRs.

Nuclear receptors cause action through mRNA, gene expression, and DNA transcription. These effects take more time to cause a change that is noticable than GPRC induced changes, such as caffeine, which is an adenosine antagonist. Adenosine receptors as an example, mediate their action through secondary messengers, and are much much quicker, within minutes they produce a noticable change.

Now E2 is also known to bind to GPRCs such as GPR30(G coupled protein receptor 30) which is known to cause rapid effects, like caffeine, but only some of estrogens effects are mediated through this receptor, it's believed to regulate the HPTA, which could explain why shutdown happens in days, not weeks, and makes sense as what good is a negative feedback system if it takes WEEKS to regulate hormone levels?

A few others, like vasodilation, and possibly water regulation in the body.

Hopefully that makes sense, all of this is correct to the best of my understanding and would love for Dr Saya or someone else who knows more to proofread it.

I had testing done last June and they said every 6 months is normal (not) and everything was in range except RBC was a little high 6.05 (6.0 upper limit) and albumin 4.9 (4.8 upper limit) FSH and LH low but that is from the TRT I was told

My SHGB was at 16 (10-80 range)
DHEA at 355 (88.9-427)
Test total 415
Free 10.86
E2 28.4
IGF-1 167
Cortisol 16.1 (morning)


I wish I never did the AI, even getting boobs (temporarily) would have been better than feeling lower than dirt

johndoesmith said:

So at 6 weeks you measured E2, and 2 weeks later you felt better, or an additional 8 weeks after the E2 test?

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2 weeks after the labs I felt good again. So 8 weeks total after stopping the AI, but only 2 weeks after the lab test.

Your theory is interesting.

Leesto said:

2 weeks after the labs I felt good again. So 8 weeks total after stopping the AI, but only 2 weeks after the lab test.

Your theory is interesting.

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Well, it's not a theory, that's how it actually works. At least to the best of my understanding. Receptor function is a very complicated subject.

I'm feeling better just knowing that it is most likely the low E causing these symptoms and not a major disease

interesting reading on GPR30 here http://press.endocrine.org/doi/full/10.1210/mend.16.1.0758

stevenlee34983 said:

I'm feeling better just knowing that it is most likely the low E causing these symptoms and not a major disease

interesting reading on GPR30 here http://press.endocrine.org/doi/full/10.1210/mend.16.1.0758

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Any Joint pain, Anhedonia, excessive pissing, excessive thirst, dry skin, feeling "old", zero libido, and hot flashes that itch intensely?

Very interesting article, I believe I've seen it before, but honestly that first part of it is incredibly complex. You read most of it?

Yes, twitching and fatigue being the worst of the symptoms, joint pain, anhedonia, major excessive urination even at night which doesn't help the insomnia, I drink lots of water constantly so I don't feel thirsty mostly, I drink on average of 100oz a day, libido not great, anxiety

I thought I had Lyme Disease or MS as I had/have crushing chronic fatigue and twitching, it seems to be getting better though, the worrisome thing about my recovery (which is how I hopefully refer to it) is that sometimes I have a mostly normal day of feeling somewhat human, then the next day back to poo

I've had a few days of feeling better (far from 100% though closer) I took a couple shots of hcg I believe it was 600ius IIRC one wednesday and thursday, was starting to feel better a couple days before that, but today I feel nausea and somewhat rundown, I just took 120MG test Cypionate via SubQ a little bit ago as it was time (wasn't feeling well before that) I'm hoping to feel better tomorrow and I did some searching on this site and have found others that have had nausea temporarily while taking HCG, just wondering if this is common (I will update tomorrow)

thank you all very much
Steve

stevenlee34983 said:

I've had a few days of feeling better (far from 100% though closer) I took a couple shots of hcg I believe it was 600ius IIRC one wednesday and thursday, was starting to feel better a couple days before that, but today I feel nausea and somewhat rundown, I just took 120MG test Cypionate via SubQ a little bit ago as it was time (wasn't feeling well before that) I'm hoping to feel better tomorrow and I did some searching on this site and have found others that have had nausea temporarily while taking HCG, just wondering if this is common (I will update tomorrow)

thank you all very much
Steve

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Yiu are using HCG in an on again/off again basis? How are you dosing it - based on subjective feeling? Your testosterone is an every 3.5 day protocol.

I just took two shots last week which was in between the Test shots, I took HCG a few times a couple years ago, but can't remember if it did anything or side effects.

I'm not feeling well today, fatigue and slight brain fog

I'll be getting bloodwork by my regular dr this wednesday and she will review it next week

I will be doing another sensitive estradiol test in a couple weeks at the most to see how much my levels have rebounded

thank you very much for your reply I really appreciate it
Steve

stevenlee34983 said:

I just took two shots last week which was in between the Test shots, I took HCG a few times a couple years ago, but can't remember if it did anything or side effects.

I'm not feeling well today, fatigue and slight brain fog

I'll be getting bloodwork by my regular dr this wednesday and she will review it next week

I will be doing another sensitive estradiol test in a couple weeks at the most to see how much my levels have rebounded

thank you very much for your reply I really appreciate it
Steve

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Protocols succeed when they are consistent. Consistency permits a careful assessment of what is and isn't working. Changes made in the face of on/off dosing are likely to be unsatisfactory. Like it or not, patience will help you achieve hour goals.