1. #1

    estradiol Roche ECLIA methodology

    my doctor did this test for checking my E2. it came back at 25.8 with a rand of 7.6-42.6

    I have read that it should have been the estradiol sensitive test.

    is there a different in these 2 test?

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  3. #2
    The Roche ECLIA test is for women and not accurate for men. The Estradiol Sensitive, LC/MS/MS assay, is the one that produces the more accurate results for men. It is highly recommended to test with the Sensitive assay.

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    read on other boards that you can subtract 10 from the roche method and get a ball park idea for the sensitive test. any truth? if not how far apart are these 2 test? anyone done both test at the same time to compare?

  5. #4
    Well when it comes to your Estradiol, it is something you really shouldn't guess at or want a ballpark figure on. I will share with you my personal experience on it. In May of this year I had both test run. My non-sensitive estradiol, the Roche ECLIA methodology came in at 91.0 pg/ml. The estradiol sensitive test, the LC/MS/MS assay, came in at 35.3 pg/ml. Quite a bit more than a 10 point difference. Had I used the Roche ECLIA of 91.0 and taken 10 points off of it and been treated at 81 and I would have been screwed. Some doctor would have prescribed some huge dose of an AI. Before you know it I would have crashed my estradiol and been in bad shape. You DO NOT want to crash your estradiol.

    So so I would have to call BS on just adjusting the Roche ECLIA by 10 points. I do not understand why anyone would take that chance with their health and well being. Some people in countries outside the US don’t have the sensitive test available, but if it is available it should be used.

  6. #5
    Moderator Vince's Avatar
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    It's pointless to try and compare no matter what they read, ROCHE is wrong.
    I am not a medical practitioner. Any suggestions I provide are not medical recommendations and are just my opinions. Please consult with your physician on any matters concerning your health.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by nolefan View Post
    read on other boards that you can subtract 10 from the roche method and get a ball park idea for the sensitive test. any truth? if not how far apart are these 2 test? anyone done both test at the same time to compare?
    Nothing - not one damn thing - in the TRT universe is as linear as your question implies. I've run its test simultaneously (two separate occasions) and in one instance the values differed by 2 metrics, but the second experiment yielded a difference of 14.
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

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    so my doctor just doesn't have the knowledge to know which test to use

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by nolefan View Post
    so my doctor just doesn't have the knowledge to know which test to use
    Sadly, he/she isn't the only doctor out if his depth in this matter. You can pull it yourself, all work done through LabCorp, via www.discountedlabs.com. Many of us use this service to monitor our progress. Reasonable prices, good service.

    You have to be your own advocate (as we all eventually find out).
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

  10. #9
    Moderator Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolefan View Post
    so my doctor just doesn't have the knowledge to know which test to use
    Maybe you should bring up a threat on the right estradiol test for men and give it to him. He should get educated sooner or later.
    I am not a medical practitioner. Any suggestions I provide are not medical recommendations and are just my opinions. Please consult with your physician on any matters concerning your health.

  11. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by nolefan View Post
    so my doctor just doesn't have the knowledge to know which test to use
    Are there any other questions or concerns, red lights blinking, about the care you're getting?
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

  12. #11
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    After some more reading it seem guys that do both test are getting a lower reading with the sensitive test. That could be my problem. My E2 could be lower than the doctor thinks which could be causing my problems

    I am going to pay for my own sensitive test

    My trt protocol

    200mg test c week( 2 injections of 100mg week)
    12.5mg aromasin on injection days

    Issues

    No sex drive
    Ed
    Spiked high blood pressure
    Just feel like shit

    When I stop the AI for a week or so I feel better

  13. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by nolefan View Post
    After some more reading it seem guys that do both test are getting a lower reading with the sensitive test. That could be my problem. My E2 could be lower than the doctor thinks which could be causing my problems

    I am going to pay for my own sensitive test

    My trt protocol

    200mg test c week( 2 injections of 100mg week)
    12.5mg aromasin on injection days

    Issues

    No sex drive
    Ed
    Spiked high blood pressure
    Just feel like shit

    When I stop the AI for a week or so I feel better
    Where does your SHBG sit?
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

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    He didnt test for that this time. He did test for SHBG a year ago but I don't have those results now. But I do know it was in the normal range

    Here are my results

    This is 4 days after an injection

    Total T 550
    Free T 25
    Estradiol standard 25

  15. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by nolefan View Post
    He didnt test for that this time. He did test for SHBG a year ago but I don't have those results now. But I do know it was in the normal range

    Here are my results

    This is 4 days after an injection

    Total T 550
    Free T 25
    Estradiol standard 25
    Always test, have your blood drawn, just prior to an injection. You want to capture your trough testosterone value, to see how well you are sustaining a healthy level over the course of a fixed period of time, and you want to capture your estradiol somewhere near its peak. Testing just before an injection accomplishes both goals ("E follows T"). Your SHBG being "normal" means absolutely nothing. High normal? Low normal? Middle-of-the-road normal? The answer to those questions determines how to draw up your protocol. What did your doctor discuss with you in that regard? Low to lower SHBG - more frequent injections with somewhat less testosterone. High(er) SHBG means fewer, larger injections. This should have been discussed and weighed.
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

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    I inject 100mg on Wednesday and Saturday. I gave blood on Wednesday before I inject. So 4 days has passed since last injection

  17. #16
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    I am done taking an AI. They make me feel so bad and I have no sex drive and ED. I will lower my dose if needed or stop TRT totally. AIs are nasty drugs.

  18. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by nolefan View Post
    I am done taking an AI. They make me feel so bad and I have no sex drive and ED. I will lower my dose if needed or stop TRT totally. AIs are nasty drugs.
    I won't go that far. Anastrozole is a powerful and overprescribed drug. It has nasty effects when it's employed when it shouldn't be, but some men certainly do need it to make their protocol effective. Keep in mind that TRT hasn't failed, I'd suggest your doctor has failed. You deserve better care.
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

  19. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by nolefan View Post
    read on other boards that you can subtract 10 from the roche method and get a ball park idea for the sensitive test. any truth? if not how far apart are these 2 test? anyone done both test at the same time to compare?
    Not at all. When I run both tests side-by-side I've pulled a higher sensitive test almost every time and if it's not higher it's equal too.

    Trying to equate the two when it can't be done is just people trying to make up for their mistake, their Dr's mistake, cost differences in the test...and so on.

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