Thread: Bad reaction?

  1. #1

    Bad reaction?

    OK, I've only been on TRT for two weeks now. Defy patient. My original blood work was:

    Testosterone,Free and Total Testosterone, Serum 343 ng/dL 264 - 916
    Free Testosterone(Direct)11.8 pg/mL 6.8 - 21.5
    DHEA-Sulfate 279.1 ug/dL 71.6 - 375.4
    01TSH 2.040 uIU/mL 0.450 - 4.500
    Luteinizing Hormone(LH), S LH 5.0 mIU/mL 1.7 - 8.6
    Prostate-Specific Ag, Serum Prostate Specific Ag, Serum 0.5 ng/mL 0.0 - 4.0 01



    Estradiol, Sensitive 26.1 pg/mL 8.0 - 35.0

    Sex Horm Binding Glob, Serum 31.2 nmol/L 16.5 - 55.9

    Hemocrit 44.2%


    Was prescribed 70 mg test cyp twice a week, 500iu HCG twice a week, and .25 mg anastrozole. Knowing the prevailing opinions here about AI in general, and especially before showing symptoms of high E2, I put off taking the AI. I took my first shot the evening of Tuesday Feb 6 test cyp and HCG as prescribed. No AI. Friday the 9th, same thing. Decided to go with Monday nights and Friday mornings. Monday the 12th was my third shot. That night I took one of the .25mg anastrozole capsules.

    Felt just fine all this time up to Wednesday afternoon. Almost 48 hours after I took the anastrozole I was in Walmart and suddenly felt terrible, broke out in a sweat, shaky hands, felt like my knees were knocking, and a general sense of impending doom. I grabbed a Gatorade (hadn't eaten enough that day) checked out of there and went straight home. Felt Ok since.

    Sent a message about it to Defy and was contacted by phone. The guy I talked to recommended staying on the anastrozole twice a week but start doing my HCG shots the day before the test shots, and still taking the AI on the day of the test shots. Theory being that a new patient may be just having trouble with that much hormone at once (the HCG and test).

    I know we can't know for sure without an E2 sensitive test if it's high or low but of course I'm thinking it was the AI that triggered the episode. I am not prone to panic attacks. I did experience a couple in 2010, was at a very high stress period in my career and we lost my 8 year old daughter to a bad case of pneumonia. Black days.
    Last edited by pistolero; 02-17-2018 at 03:50 PM. Reason: I'm a dumbass!

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  3. #2
    Member madman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pistolero View Post
    OK, I've only been on TRT for two weeks now. Defy patient. My original blood work was:

    Testosterone,Free and Total Testosterone, Serum 343 ng/dL 264 - 916
    Free Testosterone(Direct)11.8 pg/mL 6.8 - 21.5
    DHEA-Sulfate 279.1 ug/dL 71.6 - 375.4
    01TSH 2.040 uIU/mL 0.450 - 4.500
    Luteinizing Hormone(LH), S LH 5.0 mIU/mL 1.7 - 8.6
    Prostate-Specific Ag, Serum Prostate Specific Ag, Serum 0.5 ng/mL 0.0 - 4.0 01

    Estradiol, Sensitive 26.1 pg/mL 8.0 - 35.0

    Sex Horm Binding Glob, Serum 31.2 nmol/L 16.5 - 55.9

    Hemocrit 44.2%


    Was prescribed 70 mg test cyp twice a week, 500iu HCG twice a week, and .25 mg anastrozole. Knowing the prevailing opinions here about AI in general, and especially before showing symptoms of high E2, I put off taking the AI. I took my first shot the evening of Tuesday Feb 6 test cyp and HCG as prescribed. No AI. Friday the 9th, same thing. Decided to go with Monday mornings and Friday evenings. Monday morning the 12th was my third shot. That night I took one of the .25mg anastrozole capsules.

    Felt just fine all this time up to Wednesday afternoon. Almost 48 hours after I took the anastrozole I was in Walmart and suddenly felt terrible, broke out in a sweat, shaky hands, felt like my knees were knocking, and a general sense of impending doom. I grabbed a Gatorade (hadn't eaten enough that day) checked out of there and went straight home. Felt Ok since.

    Sent a message about it to Defy and was contacted by phone. The guy I talked to recommended staying on the anastrozole twice a week but start doing my HCG shots the day before the test shots, and still taking the AI on the day of the test shots. Theory being that a new patient may be just having trouble with that much hormone at once (the HCG and test).

    I know we can't know for sure without an E2 sensitive test if it's high or low but of course I'm thinking it was the AI that triggered the episode. I am not prone to panic attacks. I did experience a couple in 2010, was at a very high stress period in my career and we lost my 8 year old daughter to a bad case of pneumonia. Black days.
    100mg-120mg (50mg or 60mg every 3.5 days) without the use of an aromatose inhibitor would have been a better starting protocol as 140mg/week (70mg every 3.5 days) is still a fairly high starting dose of testsosterone.

    Sure increasing your t will increase e2 but it is not a given that you will experience high e2 symptoms.

    Would have been much better to see how your body reacts without an a.i. and than decide after 6-8 weeks unless you started to experience high e2 symptoms.

    Your hpta is still not fully shutdown at 2 weeks on trt and your test levels are in flux which will take 6 weeks to stabilize.

    During the first 6 weeks it is hard to truly gauge how one feels at a specific dose of testosterone as even once your levels stabilize on a new protocol (dosage increase/decrease or injection frequency) it can take time for certain low t symptoms to improve.

    I feel it is always best to start low and go slow when using testosterone so one can see how it will effect their total/free t, estradiol, prolactin, dht, shbg and hematocrit/hemoglobin among other important health markers.

    Unless one has elevated e2 along with high e2 symptoms pre-trt than avoiding the use of an a.i. when first starting a protocol will let one see whether they truly need to add an a.i.

    Monday mornings and Thursday evening should be your injection frequency not Monday mornings/Friday evenings as you want to keep injections every 3.5 days.

    Before you jump to conclusions you need to let your levels stabilize. The first 6 weeks is usually considered the honeymoon period!

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    Sorry for the confusion. I'm doing Monday nights / Friday mornings. Edited original post to correct.

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    Quote Originally Posted by madman View Post
    Before you jump to conclusions you need to let your levels stabilize. The first 6 weeks is usually considered the honeymoon period!
    Yeah I can't wait to wake up one morning and feel like I'm Chuck Norris.
    Thanks.

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    140mg a week didn't sound like too much to me, LOL! I'm around 230lbs, but I should be 185-190. Of course, this is all new to me. I was just glad I got a chance to try TRT. Thanks for the wise advice madman. I can't help thinking that the AI is not for me. Yet, anyway. I will take it per the Dr's advice but if that happens again I'll insist on a E2 test, and stopping AI until it comes back. Maybe at least lower the anastrozole to like .1mg until we get to the 12 week tests.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by pistolero View Post
    140mg a week didn't sound like too much to me, LOL! I'm around 230lbs, but I should be 185-190. Of course, this is all new to me. I was just glad I got a chance to try TRT. Thanks for the wise advice madman. I can't help thinking that the AI is not for me. Yet, anyway. I will take it per the Dr's advice but if that happens again I'll insist on a E2 test, and stopping AI until it comes back. Maybe at least lower the anastrozole to like .1mg until we get to the 12 week tests.
    It so easy to extinguish your e2. I would suggest you consider investing in an estradiol/sensitive test on your own (www.discountedlabs.com) to see where things stand. If anything has become clear on this forum, it's the notion that "start low and go slow" (total testosterone dose, use of estradiol, DHEA, HCG...you name it) are wise words. We've got guys over 220 pounds towing well on 100mg/week, and fellows built like a jockey who need over 150mg/weekly.
    I am not a physician. Comments offered here are for discussion purposes only. Please consult your doctor before initiating, changing, or stopping any therapy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CoastWatcher View Post
    It so easy to extinguish your e2. I would suggest you consider investing in an estradiol/sensitive test on your own (www.discountedlabs.com) to see where things stand.
    I plan to do just that. Defy does estradiol sensitive at Labcorp for $38. Thanks.

  9. #8
    Moderator Vince's Avatar
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    Could you have gotten the testosterone flu, when I first started TRT I got it. I felt like I had the flu for two weeks. Your starting estradiol levels were high for that low of total T levels.
    I am not a medical practitioner. Any suggestions I provide are not medical recommendations and are just my opinions. Please consult with your physician on any matters concerning your health.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    Could you have gotten the testosterone flu, when I first started TRT I got it. I felt like I had the flu for two weeks. Your starting estradiol levels were high for that low of total T levels.
    Naw, I don't think so. I have been feeling fine before and since that one episode.

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    Your starting estradiol levels were high for that low of total T levels.
    Must be why the Dr. started me on the anastrozole off the bat. But .5mg a week might be too much?

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