TRT with clomid

[Eric5150]

Has anyone tried trt with clomid?
150mg test cyp weekly with __mg clomid?

 

[Cataceous]

A post about this by Dr. Saya: Re: Does Clomid Work with TRT?

I have personally seen about 5 or 6 patients come to me that were on Clomid with TRT, they were attempting to use Clomid as an alternative for hCG. In EVERY ONE of those guys their LH and FSH were suppressed and they were experiencing testicular atrophy of varying degrees (supporting, at least anecdotally, that the Clomid will not have the intended results when the HPTA suppression of exogenous T is present).

 

[Dr Justin Saya MD]

A post about this by Dr. Saya: Re: Does Clomid Work with TRT?

I’ve since seen a few cases where LH and FSH were not fully suppressed and/or the patient noticed some perceived benefit in regards to testicular size. Overall, however, it does appear the suppression of TRT outweighs the stimulation from clomid when used concurrently.

 

[Eric5150]

Is that why HCG is the preferred medication?

 

[Dr Justin Saya MD]

Is that why HCG is the preferred medication?

Indeed.

 

[jhperez81]

Do you have any data on patients who are on TRT and Tamoxifen in regards to whether their LH and FSH are zero'd out.

 

[Eric5150]

Indeed.

How much time on HCG before you recommend the patient takes a break from HCG ref desensitization of LH?

 

[Jayyy]

A post about this by Dr. Saya: Re: Does Clomid Work with TRT?

I’ve since seen a few cases where LH and FSH were not fully suppressed and/or the patient noticed some perceived benefit in regards to testicular size. Overall, however, it does appear the suppression of TRT outweighs the stimulation from clomid when used concurrently.

In cases of primary hypogonadism, who have elevated LH and FSH but have low testosterone and low sperm count. Do you think clomid is better bcas their pituitary is working fine unlike secondary hypogonadism or others whos pituitary is not working. Do you think i can able to use clomid with TRT? Or do u think i can try clomid with trt for 3 months n see if i can able to maintain optimal LH/FSH levels

 

[Cataceous]

In cases of primary hypogonadism, who have elevated LH and FSH but have low testosterone and low sperm count. Do you think clomid is better bcas their pituitary is working fine unlike secondary hypogonadism or others whos pituitary is not working. Do you think i can able to use clomid with TRT? Or do u think i can try clomid with trt for 3 months n see if i can able to maintain optimal LH/FSH levels

In primary hypogondadism the pituitary is already yelling at the testicles to make more testosterone, but to no avail. Without TRT, using Clomid to make the yelling a little louder probably won't change anything. But that's an interesting question, as to whether Clomid concurrent with TRT would be more likely to stimulate LH/FSH because the HP part of the HPTA isn't malfunctioning. I think in that situation I would want to try it, though I'd prefer enclomiphene to Clomid.

 

[Vince]

How much time on HCG before you recommend the patient takes a break from HCG ref desensitization of LH?

When someone uses testosterone and HCG there's no reason to take a break. There's no desensitization.

 

[Jayyy]

In primary hypogondadism the pituitary is already yelling at the testicles to make more testosterone, but to no avail. Without TRT, using Clomid to make the yelling a little louder probably won't change anything. But that's an interesting question, as to whether Clomid concurrent with TRT would be more likely to stimulate LH/FSH because the HP part of the HPTA isn't malfunctioning. I think in that situation I would want to try it, though I'd prefer enclomiphene to Clomid.

Thanks. Yes in my case, elevated LH n FSH has caused some 2 million sperms(optimal is above 15), So i guess i will give a try. I know clomid with TRT causes increase in SBGH n estrogen level but i need to check it how it will be in my case. Never heard of enclomiphene. Thanks for this info. Ill google it. Do u think it will help for testicular failure?

 

[fifty]

Enclomiphene is one half of clomid. On paper it’s the more desirable half. Unfortunately few people have actually tried it.

 

[Jayyy]

Just googled about it. Its an amazing drug which is purely estrogen receptor blocker unlike clomifene which has both estrogen agonist and antogonist. It makes sense now why they separated enclomiphene from zuclomifene.

 

[fifty]

An amazing drug that can’t get FDA approval...

 

[Cataceous]

An amazing drug that can’t get FDA approval...

But at least it can be obtained legitimately.

 

[Jayyy]

Now the question is from where to order it. Do you guys know any good website that will ship to canada

 

[fifty]

Sounds like it’s hard for Canadians to get a pack of bubble gum shipped to them these days.

I know enclomiphene is available from some places but I know Defy won’t touch it. Plus I haven’t heard any great personal reviews. Only person I know using it is the one user on peaktestosterone.

@Cataceous did you use it?

 

[Cataceous]

Now the question is from where to order it. Do you guys know any good website that will ship to canada

Nootropicsource.com

We ship anywhere USPS ships! USPS will hand your package to your destination's local courier.

International customers who elect to ship to freight forwarding/drop shipping companies may have their orders canceled at our discretion.

Most products can now be shipped internationally. Customs policies vary widely from country to country; you should be aware of your local customs before you place your order. Additionally, when ordering from NootropicSource.com you are considered the importer of record and must comply with all laws and regulations of the country in which you are receiving the goods.

I don't have objective data supporting the quality of the products, but they reliably ship something. Others here in the forum seem to be happy with them too.

@fifty I did try one bottle. If it was the real thing then the dose and experiment duration were insufficient to overcome the suppression of TRT. No negative effects were observed, which argues in favor of little or no zuclomiphene in the product.

 

[xqfq]

What I've read on the forums here (I don't have a link at the moment) is that even if someone was secondary, clomid would be unlikely to work because the hypothalamus' feedback loop isn't driven purely from estrogen but also from testosterone.

I'd love to learn more though, and it'd be valuable to know if anyone's actually had success with this.

 

[Cataceous]

What I've read on the forums here (I don't have a link at the moment) is that even if someone was secondary, clomid would be unlikely to work because the hypothalamus' feedback loop isn't driven purely from estrogen but also from testosterone.

I'd love to learn more though, and it'd be valuable to know if anyone's actually had success with this.

Take a look at this thread, especially the second and third pages: Clomid & Testosterone: Why they don't work together - By Mike Gaiso
Some interesting info on the subject. For some technical details, don't miss this post.