Theory about determining weekly dosage

[StepbyStep]

I've had this thought for a while now. It seems like many of us simply do not feel well on TRT, even when our labs look good and we've played around with dosage frequency and TT quite a bit. One thing I've read a number of times is when a guy decides to get off of TRT, he'll feel really good 7-10 days after he quits, and then most get back on TRT after a PCT fails or their testosterone returns to their natural low levels.

I had my last Testosterone injection on December 23rd, and overall I feel much better than when I was ever on TRT. The best I felt though was on days 7-10. It felt like I passed through the sweet spot.

I was on 105mg/wk of Test and also HCG(which I was still taking for PCT). I had reached steady state levels, which means I had roughly 210mg of Test in my system when I quit. At 7-10 days, which is roughly one half life of Testosterone Cypionate, I probably only had about 100mg left in my system.

I feel like this would be a good starting point for when I eventually get back on TRT. It would be beneficial to draw labs inside of that 7-10 day window, but achieving steady state levels of 100mg would be as simple as injecting 50mg of Test Cypionate a week(plus the HCG), much lower than any dosage I've tried before.

I have no obsession with high testosterone levels or building muscle, I just simply want to feel good and get on with my life.

 

[Vince Carter]

I do think the flaw may be found in having trough levels that are at or above the lab ranges, even knowing the lab range is just a sample of the population that the lab is testing. In a general sense just being overdosed as though that's good numbers.

 

[fifty]

Agree. My troughs have been over 1500... and that's 2 to 3.5 days after injection!

 

[Vince Carter]

That's my point....we talk about being Supra, in a trough, when in reality you're supra for probably every other time in the injection cycle. In another post I posited what a guy would think of their Estrogen levels...if they saw it in the peak vs the trough.

 

[StepbyStep]

I do think the flaw may be found in having trough levels that are at or above the lab ranges, even knowing the lab range is just a sample of the population that the lab is testing. In a general sense just being overdosed as though that's good numbers.

Interesting point, I tend to agree. Perhaps a lower dosage and/or a decrease in injection frequency may be beneficial for some. Lower trough levels and a bit more variation overall. I was on EOD injections for the last 10 months, while I felt more consistent than on once weekly or E3.5D, it always resulted in just feeling consistently shitty. I often wonder if the key was to space injections to E3D and/or in variating the dosage to have a certain degree of flucuation.

 

[Gman86]

I know E2 gets brought up constantly, and people are probably sick of hearing about it, but could it be that E2 levels dropped into a more optimal range during that period where you felt better?

The only reason I bring this up is, how can steroid users feel like “Superman” when their testosterone levels are extremely high? It just makes it hard to believe that it was the higher testosterone levels that made you feel worse. It totally could of been, don’t get me wrong. Or could be that too high of testosterone levels throw off some other system, like the thyroid, for example. I’m open to all possibilities. Just curious if E2 played a part in you feeling better 7-10 days after discontinuing TRT.

 

[trt reznor]

Wondering if anyone’s tried a lower dose around here, 50mg or so. The lowest I ever see is 80mg or so.

 

[sh1973]

I do 60mg per week with sky high shbg and feel fine.

 

[Vince Carter]

I tried 10mg a day for about a week and noticably felt bad, went back to I think 12 or 14 where my FT was coming in under the lab range so I'm at 16mg/d and doing perfectly fine. But my SHBG is ~12 and I just piss it all out rather quickly every day.

 

[sh1973]

I just recently had a consult with Dr Saya and we’ve changed mine to 18mg x 3 times weekly which is only 54mg. No matter what my dose on weekly I feel best the last 2-3 days. He’s trying to duplicate that level and keep it consistent. I only started last week but so far I feel great. I’d never worked with him before, I had Dr Caulkins. So far I must say I’m impressed by Dr Saya.

 

[Gman86]

I just recently had a consult with Dr Saya and we’ve changed mine to 18mg x 3 times weekly which is only 54mg. No matter what my dose on weekly I feel best the last 2-3 days. He’s trying to duplicate that level and keep it consistent. I only started last week but so far I feel great. I’d never worked with him before, I had Dr Caulkins. So far I must say I’m impressed by Dr Saya.

Glad you’re feeling so good. So what made you switch to having consults with Dr. Saya? Were you not happy with Dr. Caulkins, or was it a scheduling thing and you just ended up with Dr. Saya this time?

 

[sh1973]

Honestly Dr Calkins seems to lean toward higher dosing, for whatever reason higher dosing doesn’t agree with me. Always heard great things about Dr Saya and I have to agree with what I’ve heard. So far feeling very consistent every day. Hope it continues for sure. I’ll do labs in a few weeks to see where things land.

 

[StepbyStep]

I know E2 gets brought up constantly, and people are probably sick of hearing about it, but could it be that E2 levels dropped into a more optimal range during that period where you felt better?

The only reason I bring this up is, how can steroid users feel like “Superman” when their testosterone levels are extremely high? It just makes it hard to believe that it was the higher testosterone levels that made you feel worse. It totally could of been, don’t get me wrong. Or could be that too high of testosterone levels throw off some other system, like the thyroid, for example. I’m open to all possibilities. Just curious if E2 played a part in you feeling better 7-10 days after discontinuing TRT.

It's hard to say, I've had TT values of 475-1200 on TRT and E2 ranging from 19-38. At my lower TT values I was on HCG mono starting with small doses, and my E2 was slightly higher than it would have been if I was on Test alone or a combination. One problem I've had is that I've never had any obvious high or low E2 symptoms, and I experimented with low dose AI for a month with no change in how I felt. My ED has in large part remained horrible for the entire time I was on TRT. My thyroid is being treated with Defy using T3 only, my labs look perfect in that area.

I agree that there must be something else going on. I fear that there are other complex factors involved that are not yet known or understood. It could be as simple as other hormones or nurotransmitters that get thrown out of whack on TRT, some of which rarely get tested. Or it could be that many of us have bad reactions to the preservatives in the Testosterone. It could be many things.

The fact that some steroid users feel great on crazy dosages and cocktails or anabolics tells me that secondary hypogonadism without a clear cause is not a diagnosis at all, but just a symptom for some.

 

[BigBamBoo]

I would have to think that most “roid” users are:

A) younger and in good shape and are spending their time working out...A LOT. And mentally are in a “be heathy” mind set.
B) are taking such large doses that it “over comes” any potential E issues.
C) probably do not have low T issues to start with.

Mental health is something that is often overlooked when we are talking about hormones.
A lot of ED issues are caused by mental issues.

It seems a lot of men look to TRT as a “magic pill”...myself included...and think that if they just get their T levels up, everything will be good.

Getting healthy in every aspect of one’s life is just as important as as to getting your T levels up.

How many guys who Get diagnosed with low T workout regularly. Take time to relax and limit stress in their lives. Have a healthy relationship with their spouse/girlfriend. Eat healthily. And just plain live healthy lives?

Knowing what I know now, TRT will be the last piece of the puzzle for me going forward.

Everyone is different of coarse.