51yr old have Testosterone, but hesitant to use

[nxanthis]

Hi, I am a 51yr old who has juice many times in the past. At 40yrs old I had a max bench of 370. At 49yrs old a max deadlift of 465. Between 40-51yrs old I had on both my right and left side, triceps partial tendon tears. I had Prolotherapy on both of them and they finally healed up after 6mos-1yr but my bench went WAY DOWN. I could barely get 300 max bench ever since. After the triceps tendons healed up, I had 2 R side shoulder injuries requiring me to get steroid injections, twice. That took a toll too. The most I can bench now is 250-255lbs. My deadlift is still 375-405 max (never hurt my back so it didn't drop off as much). But the bench press is depressing. I have lots of Testosterone that I ordered a few months ago and a little Trenbolone (Tren is awesome), but I have not touched the Test or Tren as I am hesitant. I LOVE lifting weights and getting strong, but my wife and kids say I just need to lose weight (which I do), as I am 5'10 236lbs, and get in "good shape".
I lift weights 4X/week (upper body 2 days, lower body 2 days). I have minimal time for Cardio ( but I do like long brisk walks and bike rides in nice weather, but I live up north so 65% of the year sucks for weather) but my job as a nurse requires me to walk 20,000 steps/day and I stand 70% of the day.

Question: Would it be ok for me to start on a LOW dose Testosterone regimen like 250mg/week and use up the rest of the Tren (low dose too), and stay on that for a while? Just to get my lifts up a bit and burn more fat?
My liver enzymes always are slightly elevated when I see the doctor, but they did a liver Ultrasound and it is ok. Probably fatty liver.
All my other labs are perfect.

 

[Systemlord]

Would it be ok for me to start on a LOW dose Testosterone regimen like 250mg/week

This may be pushing past TRT for dosages, more like 120-150 mg weekly.

I'm going to assume you have secondary hypogonadism, and your body needs adequate testosterone to function normally, why are you hesitant to start TRT?

 

[nxanthis]

I don't have secondary hypogonadism, that I know of. I guess I am hesitant because I am older and don't want any blood clots or heart issues. I like the 120-150mg/weekly idea.

 

[tareload]

All my other labs are perfect.

Got any Blood work?

1. TT
2. what we think may be an accurate fT measurement
3. SHBG
4. E2
5. CMP
6. CBC
7. thyroid (TSH,fT4,fT3)
8. lipids (TC,HDL-c,LDL-c,trig)
9. etc. (PSA...)

OW dose Testosterone regimen like 250mg/week and use up the rest of the Tren (low dose too), and stay on that for a while?

As in 250 mg/week of injectable test ester?

 

[nxanthis]

Got any Blood work?

TT
what we think may be an accurate fT measurement
SHBG
E2
CMP
CBC
thyroid (TSH,fT4,fT3)
lipids (TC,HDL-c,LDL-c,trig)
etc.


As in 250 mg/week of injectable test ester?

Yes, as in 250mg/week of injectable test. But I like trying a slightly lower dose (150mg/week) first. I will look for my latest labs and post them.

 

[tareload]

Gotcha.

LOW dose Testosterone regimen like 250mg/week and use up the rest of the Tren

Tool to Assess your TT Dose Response -- Percentile Curves

Summary: Tools to estimate your individual dose response for injectable testosterone ester in comparison to a normal distribution (95 percentile confidence estimate) of adult males (Ref). Plot below shows a summary of data from (1) clinical trials gathered from the literature + (2)...

forums.t-nation.com

It wouldn't be a LOW dose regimen but if you want to run a small blast of T with some tren then who are we to judge. Go in informed.

 

[Systemlord]

I guess I am hesitant because I am older and don't want any blood clots or heart issues.

What are you talking about, TRT doesn't cause heart attacks, strokes or clots.

The "creditable" medical literature doesn't support any of this.

Does Testosterone Increase the Chance for a Heart Attack?

"Many healthcare providers hesitate to initiate men on testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) due to the belief that these treatments increase the risk of cardiovascular (CV) events. However, the data supporting this belief are conflicting. A systematic review and meta-analysis of 30 randomized...

www.excelmale.com

A new study of 25,420 older men showed that testosterone does not cause heart attacks

Testosterone therapy does not increase heart attack risk, study shows Testosterone prescriptions for older men in the United States have increased more than three-fold over the past decade. Recent studies linking testosterone use with increased risk of heart attack and stroke have caused...

www.excelmale.com

Poorly Done Testosterone Studies Fuel Concerns and Lawsuits

A study published at the end of 2013 and a previous one from the Veterans Administration Hospital System (see below post) show what happens when older men are given suboptimal testosterone replacement without proper monitoring and management of factors that can affect their health...

www.excelmale.com

 

[tareload]

This may be pushing past TRT for dosages, more like 120-150 mg weekly.

I'm going to assume you have secondary hypogonadism, and your body needs adequate testosterone to function normally, why are you hesitant to start TRT?

Why would you assume that based on what OP has shared? ...

All my other labs are perfect.

 

[tareload]

What are you talking about, TRT doesn't cause heart attacks, strokes or clots.

He was talking about this, not TRT:

Would it be ok for me to start on a LOW dose Testosterone regimen like 250mg/week and use up the rest of the Tren (low dose too), and stay on that for a while?

 

[Systemlord]

He was talking about this, not TRT:

Exactly, this is a men's health forum which focuses on the treatment for low testosterone among other things, not a steroid forum like T Nation. This is why I assumed he had hypogonadism and wanted to add a bit more.

 

[tareload]

wanted to add a bit more.

...tren.

Hey maybe 1-3 mg/day could work wonders? I am still looking for the Roussel Uclaf Parabolan literature.

 

[bixt]

This is why I assumed he had hypogonadism and wanted to add a bit

Ok, I get this.

secondary hypogonadism

But now im even more perplexed, how did you come up with secondary?

 

[Systemlord]

But now im even more perplexed, how did you come up with secondary?

The most common form of low testosterone, and the age, high liver enzymes and fatty liver comment.

Been there, done that.

 

[BigTex]

Hi, I am a 51yr old who has juice many times in the past. At 40yrs old I had a max bench of 370. At 49yrs old a max deadlift of 465. Between 40-51yrs old I had on both my right and left side, triceps partial tendon tears. I had Prolotherapy on both of them and they finally healed up after 6mos-1yr but my bench went WAY DOWN. I could barely get 300 max bench ever since. After the triceps tendons healed up, I had 2 R side shoulder injuries requiring me to get steroid injections, twice. That took a toll too. The most I can bench now is 250-255lbs. My deadlift is still 375-405 max (never hurt my back so it didn't drop off as much). But the bench press is depressing. I have lots of Testosterone that I ordered a few months ago and a little Trenbolone (Tren is awesome), but I have not touched the Test or Tren as I am hesitant. I LOVE lifting weights and getting strong, but my wife and kids say I just need to lose weight (which I do), as I am 5'10 236lbs, and get in "good shape".
I lift weights 4X/week (upper body 2 days, lower body 2 days). I have minimal time for Cardio ( but I do like long brisk walks and bike rides in nice weather, but I live up north so 65% of the year sucks for weather) but my job as a nurse requires me to walk 20,000 steps/day and I stand 70% of the day.

Question: Would it be ok for me to start on a LOW dose Testosterone regimen like 250mg/week and use up the rest of the Tren (low dose too), and stay on that for a while? Just to get my lifts up a bit and burn more fat?
My liver enzymes always are slightly elevated when I see the doctor, but they did a liver Ultrasound and it is ok. Probably fatty liver.
All my other labs are perfect.

Here is some advice from an old powerlifter.....you sir have had quite a few injuries from trying to be strong. I understand your needs but I would suggest that you accept that you did good and move on like your wife and kids suggested "I just need to lose weigh and get in good shape" These injuries will come back to haunt you when you are my age (65). You can still go to the gym and lift weight and be very muscular for your age without ever doing a 1 rep max again. You are walking enough steps to be considered in very good cardiorespiratory health. 10,000 per day is the goal for health and wellness. I would suggest that you do more of a metabolic type of training where you have short (1min) rest periods in the gym combined with maybe 5-10 sets of 12 reps for each muscle group. With your size, training intensely in the weight room for 60 minutes you can burn 755 calories. ExRx.net : Exercise Calories Burned Calculator
Now this, combined with a carbohydrate cycling diet can help you drop some body fat while keeping the muscle. Keeping the weight in the 60% of 1RM range can help avoid injuries and further wear and tear on the shoulders. You don't want to end up like I did with osteoarthritis in both shoulders by not knowing when to stop the heavy weight.

Please let your doctors know also that liver enzymes can greatly be affected by weight training and muscle mass. Find yourself a good TRT doctor. With your background in using steroids you are no doubt shut down. You will find that your can still lift very hard with doses of testosterone that fall in the TRT spectrum, which can vary from person to person.

Good luck!

Weight Training Can Increase Liver Enzymes

https://www.discountedlabs.com/blog/weight-training-can-increase-liver-enzymes

www.excelmale.com

 

[Hyrulewarrior1978]

Here is some advice from an old powerlifter.....you sir have had quite a few injuries from trying to be strong. I understand your needs but I would suggest that you accept that you did good and move on like your wife and kids suggested "I just need to lose weigh and get in good shape" These injuries will come back to haunt you when you are my age (65). You can still go to the gym and lift weight and be very muscular for your age without ever doing a 1 rep max again. You are walking enough steps to be considered in very good cardiorespiratory health. 10,000 per day is the goal for health and wellness. I would suggest that you do more of a metabolic type of training where you have short (1min) rest periods in the gym combined with maybe 5-10 sets of 12 reps for each muscle group. With your size, training intensely in the weight room for 60 minutes you can burn 755 calories. ExRx.net : Exercise Calories Burned Calculator
Now this, combined with a carbohydrate cycling diet can help you drop some body fat while keeping the muscle. Keeping the weight in the 60% of 1RM range can help avoid injuries and further wear and tear on the shoulders. You don't want to end up like I did with osteoarthritis in both shoulders by not knowing when to stop the heavy weight.

Please let your doctors know also that liver enzymes can greatly be affected by weight training and muscle mass. Find yourself a good TRT doctor. With your background in using steroids you are no doubt shut down. You will find that your can still lift very hard with doses of testosterone that fall in the TRT spectrum, which can vary from person to person.

Good luck!

Weight Training Can Increase Liver Enzymes

https://www.discountedlabs.com/blog/weight-training-can-increase-liver-enzymes

www.excelmale.com

Let’s not assume he’s shut down. The body has a very good way of regulating itself back to baseline over time. Don’t be his doctor.

 

[tareload]

Let’s not assume he’s shut down. The body has a very good way of regulating itself back to baseline over time. Don’t be his doctor.

First post said labs were perfect hence I was waiting for OP to come back with 1500 ng/dl TT natty like back in the good ole 1960s (wink)

 

[BigTex]

Let’s not assume he’s shut down. The body has a very good way of regulating itself back to baseline over time. Don’t be his doctor.

Just my educated opinion from being around steroid users for over 42 years. I would still see a good TRT doctor for testing and advice.

 

[Warrior]

Seek out a trainer to help you put together a training program. Middle age means training different, especially with your injuries. Throw out the tren.

 

[nxanthis]

Thanks guys. 750 calorie burn in 60min. Wow, I will try the high reps, no more than 60% max, 1 min. rest periods. That would incorporate cardio and muscle building together. I hate to give up the heavy weight, BUT I don't want any more injuries at my age, and right now I have none so I want to keep it that way. I am not "shut down", as I have not taken any test or tren in 2+yrs., get regular erections, etc. My labs are ok but I will start on low dose Test.
"Throw out the Tren" someone replied. No way. I will use very low doses of the Tren too (along with the low dose Test) until I get rid of it in about 4 weeks.

 

[BigTex]

Dante Trudel of True Protein swears by tren as part of his TRT and claims he uses 21mg of tren a week - sub q tren at 7mg EOD. Just keep track of your blood work and don't let your lipid values get messed up. He also says he uses 138mg of testosterone a week - sub q test at roughly 23ius EOD. Good luck @nxanthis