For me personally I feel the best on once a week at 150mg. Anytime I try to divide my dose down to twice a week I feel like crap but I also have a high SHBG. Anybody else on here feel horrible on twice a week but really good when you just do once a week at a higher dose? Is there a reason I would feel much better at once a week than twice a week? My guess is higher peak levels?
Systemlord
Member
I don't think Madman will say anything of the sort, he knows I have low SHBG and understands more than anyone why it's necessary. TRT is one of those treatments where everyone will respond differently.
sokaiya
Active Member
My training partner injects x2/week because he tells me it gives him a higher estrogen conversion which he wants.
(2/7) * 120 = 34.28
Interesting - why does he want more estrogen conversion?
One way to do it is to say that 120 mg per week is (120 / 7) mg per day. You want to combine two days of injections when injecting EOD, so multiply by two to get 120 / 7 * 2 ~= 34.29 mg per day.
Assume that your average testosterone level will be about the same if you keep the total weekly dose the same. People get confused when only measuring troughs. Sure, the troughs will be higher with more frequent injections using the same average dose per day. But the peaks will be lower, and the average testosterone level doesn't change. That's not to say that you won't see subjective differences, and possibly could get by on a lower average dose when switching to more frequent injections.
Basic math. 120 per week / 7 Days in a week = 17mg per day
If you’re dosing every other day then 17x2=34
SilverSurfer
Active Member
Exactly! I have a SHBG of 50, so I feel best making sure my free testosterone is above 2% for a few days of each week. I respond better to one injection every 7 or 10 days. My hemocrit is fine. For simplicity reasons once a week is optimal. For me. Your results may vary.
SilverSurfer
Active Member
Some people respond better to a larger dose once a week, others don’t. Just because you like to jab yourself everyday doesn’t mean others find that optimal for their hormone levels. A big part of this is each individual’s SHBG. If you have a higher SHBG level, injections every day may not raise your free testosterone levels to get any benefit from TRT.
You “laugh at people”....closed minded much. You might want to stop and consider why they might feel better on that regiment vs again jabbing themselves everyday.
I won't deny this part, but physiologically it is farther from natural conditions, regardless of SHBG. Speculating, perhaps in some individuals the larger hormonal swings compensate for problems caused by the unnatural delivery of testosterone. Larger swings do result in greater peak estradiol, which could also be useful for some guys and counterproductive for others.
I’ve always felt my shot on doing one large injection once a week. For some reason everybody on here says twice a week is best but not for me. I can’t even feel the effects of the shot on twice a week. I honestly feel nothing and a little worse on twice a week. Once a week I can definitely feel it.
Is this at the trough- right before your next injection? Do you take anything else with this (HCG? AI?)
madman
Super Moderator
You are trying convince me that you get a more even distribution of a hormone if you take it less frequently?
- where did he state such?
- many are well aware that injecting daily results in more stable blood levels throughout the week.....let alone minimal peak--->trough compared to less injection frequency
- does that mean everyone on trt needs to do such or it is the best and only way.....ABSOLUTELY NOT!
Same thing goes for HCG. I laugh at people that take two huge shots per week as most everyone would be much better off doing something along the lines of 100iu/day!
- most everyone.....LOL!
This is coming from a guy who stated....."I use BD 1ml syringe with Luer-Lok Tip. I pull out the Test with a 22G pin, then change the tip to a 27Gx1/2" and inject into my deltoid"
i was doing 20mg EOD ~ 70mg/week. I don't recommend that anyone dose x2/week. It's either EOD, ED, or just get on cream. That is MY opinion.
That said, i am now titrating down to 10mg EOD to see how i feel. Less is More.
- let's jab our neoprene rubber with a 22G EOD to draw a measly 10IU = 20 mg esterified testosterone if the strength is 200 mg/ml (most commonly prescribed).....than switch out tips.....sure drawing would be much quicker for large volumes but for one who injects daily or EOD using a low volume of oil than it would be more sensible to use a .5ml or .3ml fixed insulin syringe 27-29 gauge (low dead space).....minimal waste of medication and one can still draw/inject using the same needle and time to do such is minimal if done properly
- you are just hacking the sh** out of the neoprene rubber poking it numerous times per month with a 22G.....let alone wasting medication switching out tips!
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madman
Super Moderator
No one is saying injecting twice weekly (every 3.5 days) is best it is just more common and will result in more stable blood levels throughout the week when compared to injecting once weekly.....let alone the peak--->trough levels will be less extreme
Injecting more frequently as in EOD or daily will result in more stable blood levels.
Everyone has a protocol that works best for them (dose/injection frequency) whether injecting once weekly, twice weekly (every 3.5 days), M/W/F, EOD or daily.....so it is not a given that injecting more frequently is the only way or best for everyone.....complete bull****!
If you feel great injecting once weekly than stay the course regardless of what others state.....do what is best for you.
Keep in mind that when injecting once weekly using larger doses of T.....not only will your peak--->trough be more extreme compared to injecting lower doses more frequently but 24-48 hrs post injection (I would say closer to 24hr) your TT/FT/E2 levels will be very high and in some cases well into the supra-physiological range which can have a large impact on driving up your hemoglobin/hematocrit levels.....so you better make sure you know where your levels sit when using exogenous testosterone and blood work is key!
madman
Super Moderator
I am well aware why Systemlord chose a protocol using lower doses of T injected daily...it works best for him.....let alone he has low SHBG.
Keep that on the down low. If @madman hear's about that, he's going to FREAK out and tell you that you are completely INSANE for injecting so frequently!!!
I have been on the forum for 3 years.....never knew he injected daily.....LOL!
He knows I would never question such.
Dude 10mg EOD aka 35mg EW is very very low no?
madman
Super Moderator
Seeing as he stated....."That said, i am now titrating down to 10mg EOD to see how i feel. Less is More"
Never hear of one injecting such a low weekly total dose of esterified T (10 mg EOD).....hard to believe one would be able to achieve a healthy FT level let alone the overall beneficial effects of testosterone!
madman
Super Moderator
He stated to you in a previous post....."i was doing 20mg EOD ~ 70mg/week. I don't recommend that anyone dose x2/week. It's either EOD, ED, or just get on cream. That is MY opinion"
"That said, i am now titrating down to 10mg EOD to see how i feel. Less is More"
You went on to ask....."What are your levels on 20mg eod, and do u have low shbg?"
He replied..... "I get monthly labs and levels are 700-800. SHBG is normal. Not low, not high"
Now the clown wants to go and cut his weekly dose in half!
When one is tweaking a protocol whether increasing/decreasing dose a 10 mg reduction in weekly T dose can have a big impact on ones TT/FT levels.....he is cutting his weekly dose in half.....70 mg--->35 mg which is a huge drop (35 mg/week less) and although he is injecting more frequently......his levels will still drop a lot.
"That said, i am now titrating down to 10mg EOD to see how i feel. Less is More"
You went on to ask....."What are your levels on 20mg eod, and do u have low shbg?"
He replied..... "I get monthly labs and levels are 700-800. SHBG is normal. Not low, not high"
Now the clown wants to go and cut his weekly dose in half!
When one is tweaking a protocol whether increasing/decreasing dose a 10 mg reduction in weekly T dose can have a big impact on ones TT/FT levels.....he is cutting his weekly dose in half.....70 mg--->35 mg which is a huge drop (35 mg/week less) and although he is injecting more frequently......his levels will still drop a lot.
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Madman,
I don't know why there is an argument. There are more benefits to increasing dose frequency of testosterone. It doesn't mean that everyone NEEDS to switch, he's saying their are more benefits, which their are. At the same time, even if it was a opinion that higher frequency has more benefits, everyone is entitled to their opinion. Many prominent doctors use higher frequency dosing with improved labs and symptoms.
madman
Super Moderator
Again may be more beneficial for some.....it is not a given that labs let alone symptoms are going to be improved upon.....as many can achieve symptom relief and healthy blood markers when injecting less frequently.....me being one of them!
It comes down to the individual and how they respond to testosterone.
Not only do genetics play a big role..... ones sensitivity of the AR, AR density, CAG repeat length (short/long), SHBG level, degree to which one aromatizes.
You should very well know that achieving lower e2 levels, lower hemo/hematocrit is not a given when one is injecting more frequently using lower doses.
You also should know that there are also many injecting daily using fairly high doses.....running very high TT/FT levels who end up running into numerous issues regarding symptom relief let negative effects on blood markers.
You even have some who are injecting daily using reasonable doses and still end up with high TT/FT levels that can still end up with issues.
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