Using nandrolone with Testosterone for less side effects

#21
Not all studies mention dose in the abstract.. The two studies that mention dose are, first, a rat study:

"10 mg/kg body weight of nandrolone was administered intramuscularly twice a week for 8 weeks. This dose is comparable with a dose frequently used by heavy AAS abusers [1600 mg a week for a 80 kg man]."

The second, a rabbit study used a much larger dose:

" The effect of chronic treatment for 16 weeks with testosterone (25 mg−1 kg−1 week−1) and nandrolone (50 mg−1 kg−1 week−1) on serum lipids of male hypercholesterolemic New Zealand rabbits was investigated. [2000 mg and 4000 mg a week for a 80 kg man]"

Must have been some big bunnies by the end of the 16 weeks. So the relevance of these results to doses that would typically be used in TRT (no more than 150 mg a week) is not clear.
 
#22
Not all studies mention dose in the abstract.. The two studies that mention dose are, first, a rat study:

"10 mg/kg body weight of nandrolone was administered intramuscularly twice a week for 8 weeks. This dose is comparable with a dose frequently used by heavy AAS abusers [1600 mg a week for a 80 kg man]."

The second, a rabbit study used a much larger dose:

" The effect of chronic treatment for 16 weeks with testosterone (25 mg−1 kg−1 week−1) and nandrolone (50 mg−1 kg−1 week−1) on serum lipids of male hypercholesterolemic New Zealand rabbits was investigated. [2000 mg and 4000 mg a week for a 80 kg man]"

Must have been some big bunnies by the end of the 16 weeks. So the relevance of these results to doses that would typically be used in TRT (no more than 150 mg a week) is not clear.
So essentially they were designed to find an effect, a negative effect. I'd be amazed if such doses didn't result in a negative outcome of some sort. Lets try 20x the dose of all manner of drugs we know to be safe at typical therapeutic doses and see what happens... So, human studies using doses actually reflective of a therapeutic human dose, is what we need. Those are essentially of no value at all to making any clinical decisions, although it's not uncommon to see lipid changes at typical bbing doses, which are still well below the above. 200mg-800mg were pretty typical bbing doses, but of course rarely used alone, so again, confounders that don't allow accurate choices.
 
#23
The conclusion of that article is saying 10x more harmful than testosterone. Red flag. Testosterone is harmful to arteries? That’s funny. Every study seems to indicate otherwise.

It also does not account for the protective effects of ample estrogen in the study. I don’t give it much credence.

Nandrolone is one of the more studied compounds that has been used for decades. It doesn’t seem to be killing people. Bloodwork doesn’t indicate it to wreak havoc on the lipids especially bad.

There’s not a strong case against it, but you are venturing further into the unknown. You are halfway there with TRT anyway. No solid long term studies. Lots of reasons to be optimistic though.
 

Nelson Vergel

Founder, ExcelMale.com
#24
"The effect of chronic treatment for 16 weeks with testosterone (25 mg−1 kg−1 week−1) and nandrolone (50 mg−1 kg−1 week−1)"

Which is equivalent to 2000 mg per week of T and 4,000 mg nandrolone per week for an 80 Kg (175 Lb) man.

Common! LOL
 
#26
"The effect of chronic treatment for 16 weeks with testosterone (25 mg−1 kg−1 week−1) and nandrolone (50 mg−1 kg−1 week−1)"

Which is equivalent to 2000 mg per week of T and 4,000 mg nandrolone per week for an 80 Kg (175 Lb) man.

Common! LOL
That the rats/mice/rabbits didn't just drop dead half way through the study at those doses is litteraly support for the relative safety of that compound.
 
#29
The issue with nandrolone is that it wreaks havoc on the arteries. If it weren't for that, I'd be an advocate for its use (although there is some data suggesting it is neurotoxic). For patients with legitimate cachexia, it's one thing to improve their quality of life at the expense of long-term risk, but the prospect of heart disease is just too dangerous for otherwise healthy men. The data I've seen suggests that even a low dose (50-100mg) could pose a serious risk to cardiovascular health.
I'm with Will, what is your source, please post it?
 
#30
i guess i'm one of the few here taking both t and n (in my case, for a muscle wasting disease). both at 200 mg twice a week dosages. i started at 300 each, but i've gotten terrible acne, face, chest, back, arms, so i've reduced the doses by a third. it's been about six weeks now, with no change in the acne, for which i've also tried zinc soap, selsen blue, all different manner of things. just started doxy a week ago and no change with that yet either.

anyway, i don't believe i've experienced side effects from the n but then again i'm not sure what i'd be looking for.

my muscle atrophy hasn't gotten any worse since starting about 2 years aafio, but not any better either. i'm afraid to stop now, just 'cause if things did get worse, i'd be getting very close to life in a wheelchair.
 
#31
i guess i'm one of the few here taking both t and n (in my case, for a muscle wasting disease). both at 200 mg twice a week dosages. i started at 300 each, but i've gotten terrible acne, face, chest, back, arms, so i've reduced the doses by a third. it's been about six weeks now, with no change in the acne, for which i've also tried zinc soap, selsen blue, all different manner of things. just started doxy a week ago and no change with that yet either.

anyway, i don't believe i've experienced side effects from the n but then again i'm not sure what i'd be looking for.

my muscle atrophy hasn't gotten any worse since starting about 2 years aafio, but not any better either. i'm afraid to stop now, just 'cause if things did get worse, i'd be getting very close to life in a wheelchair.

The acne is from the deca for sure, try Nizoral, it's the only thing that semi works for me
 
#34
I had shoulder surgery 2 months ago and it was recommended to try low dose Deca to help with recovery. So I started this week, with 100mg per week, split e3.5 along with my T. I hope it works.
 
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