HRT has been a game changer in every aspect of my life

[MarkM]

A lot of people think E2 should be in a ratio to testosterone .

"The healthy ratio should be above 14 (ng/dl of T divided by m=pg/ml of E2) from two small studies on fertility. "

https://www.excelmale.com/forum/thr...estradiol-levels-the-facts.15905/#post-118843

Here is a thread taking in more detail about the ratio. However, it doesn't seem to be a well proven theory.

I ask because last blood test my TT was 1389, FT 28.4 and sensitive E2 56.2. According to the ratio theory I am at 24.8 and me E2 should actually be higher like at least 70.

I am not doing anything because I expect my TT to decline and with it E2, and as far as symptoms perhaps I am a little more bitchy than usual, but I have always been sarcastic so hard to tell if it's unusual and no other symptoms that I can see.

So when looking at E2 levels, do you all factor in TT and FT at all?

Nelson said based on this theory that the ratio should fall between a range of 14 to 20 for a healthy level of estradiol. I think the T:E2 ratio has to be taken with a grain of salt or within reason. Like you Dragon, my Total T is 1050 and my E2 is 35.3 which give me a ratio of 29.8 and using the theory my E2 should be fall within a range of 53 to 75 which I think would be too high for me.

However, I did have E2 for a while of 67, which would fall within the "theory range" for my numbers and I did not have high E2 symptoms but it was only for a month or two. Damn, maybe that theory is more accurate than I thought it was.

 

[DragonBits]

Nelson said based on this theory that the ratio should fall between a range of 14 to 20 for a healthy level of estradiol. I think the T:E2 ratio has to be taken with a grain of salt or within reason. Like you Dragon, my Total T is 1050 and my E2 is 35.3 which give me a ratio of 29.8 and using the theory my E2 should be fall within a range of 53 to 75 which I think would be too high for me.

However, I did have E2 for a while of 67, which would fall within the "theory range" for my numbers and I did not have high E2 symptoms but it was only for a month or two. Damn, maybe that theory is more accurate than I thought it was.

Well, I sure as hell am not going to look for estrogen gel to increase my E2.

I did gain 5-6 lbs water weight for 3 weeks or so, then after I did two hours of bike riding on a hot day, it all came off in one night. Maybe coincidence, or maybe it was a trigger and it would have gradually come down. But high T can also cause water weight, and if I hadn't gotten on the scale I wouldn't have known it.

My T/E2 ratio has never been as low as 20, sometimes it has been as high as 65, typically I never have a lot of estrogen, this test of 56.2 E2 is the highest I have ever seen E2, but my TT of 1389 ng/dl was also the highest.

I couldn't tell by how I felt that my TT was that high, I thought maybe at most 800-900 ng/dl. I understand why it was high, but didn't think it was that high.

 

[Blackhawk]

I wouldn’t want to go below 75 pmol/l or over 110 pmol/l on the top side. Of course it’s all individual and whether you have low or high E2 symptoms but this should be a safe range.

Mark, I am remembering this exact range from a chart in pg/ml of roughly 20-29 for healthy men including in their 20's. Do you know where this reference is?

 

[MarkM]

Mark, I am remembering this exact range from a chart in pg/ml of roughly 20-29 for healthy men including in their 20's. Do you know where this reference is?

Is this what you are looking for?

Estradiol Levels by Age:

These are the standard pg/ml figures. To convert to pmol/l the conversion factor is 3.671. Example: 20 pg/ml = 73.42 pmol/l.

• 20-29: 28.0 pg/ml
• 30-39: 25.7 pg/ml
• 40-49: 24.7 pg/ml
• 50-59: 22.1 pg/ml
• 60-69: 21.5 pg/ml
• 70-80: 21.9 pg/ml

More details at:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Normal_Estradiol_Levels_Men.aspx

 

[MarkM]

Here's a conversion chart too. You can switch the conversion from pmol/l to pg/ml or from pg/ml to pmol/l near the bottom of the page.

http://www.endmemo.com/medical/unitconvert/Estradiol.php

 

[Blackhawk]

Mark, I am remembering this exact range from a chart in pg/ml of roughly 20-29 for healthy men including in their 20's. Do you know where this reference is?

Is this what you are looking for?

Estradiol Levels by Age:

These are the standard pg/ml figures. To convert to pmol/l the conversion factor is 3.671. Example: 20 pg/ml = 73.42 pmol/l.

• 20-29: 28.0 pg/ml
• 30-39: 25.7 pg/ml
• 40-49: 24.7 pg/ml
• 50-59: 22.1 pg/ml
• 60-69: 21.5 pg/ml
• 70-80: 21.9 pg/ml

More details at:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Normal_Estradiol_Levels_Men.aspx

That's the one. Thanks.

 

[littlemanb]

Hi everyone..just to update on my TRT progress..I just did my 3 months post TRT bloodwork on my 50mg, subq, every 3.5 days protocol of enanthate..I attached the pre and post bloodwork for everyone’s perusal and for any comments or questions you may have..it took me about 9-10 weeks before I really started to feel the changing effects of the TRT protocol.i feel about 75% better as of today’s date..my doctor was initially concerned about my low red blood cell count (anemia) and low liver function prior to TRT and thought the TRT would improve it, which from the bloodwork, looks like it did..

I also took the blood at my trough, just prior to my injection..my TT and Free T look pretty good..I don’t think the doctor will change my dosage protocol at this point..I’m glad subq is working as I did not want to do IM..my doctor was a little hesitant about my suggesting a subq protocol as he is more into IM but was interested in working with me on the subq injections because all of his patients do weekly IM injections..

Hope all this helps!

Regards,

Mark

 

[Systemlord]

SHBG should decrease further in the months to come, usually SHBG finds its own level after several months. Noticed ferritin decreased a little and also TSH decreased probably do to restoring metabolic rates.

 

[ERO]

Congratulations on your TRT success. Consider yourself one of the lucky guys that has a response this positive. Many of us never get there.

 

[madman]

Hi everyone..just to update on my TRT progress..I just did my 3 months post TRT bloodwork on my 50mg, subq, every 3.5 days protocol of enanthate..I attached the pre and post bloodwork for everyone’s perusal and for any comments or questions you may have..it took me about 9-10 weeks before I really started to feel the changing effects of the TRT protocol.i feel about 75% better as of today’s date..my doctor was initially concerned about my low red blood cell count (anemia) and low liver function prior to TRT and thought the TRT would improve it, which from the bloodwork, looks like it did..

I also took the blood at my trough, just prior to my injection..my TT and Free T look pretty good..I don’t think the doctor will change my dosage protocol at this point..I’m glad subq is working as I did not want to do IM..my doctor was a little hesitant about my suggesting a subq protocol as he is more into IM but was interested in working with me on the subq injections because all of his patients do weekly IM injections..

Hope all this helps!

Regards,

Mark

TT/FT levels (trough) look good.....FT in top end range.

Your AM Cortisol is low and you need to look into your elevated Bilirubin.

Seeing as you are in Canada and your blood work was done through Lifelabs the estradiol test (standard) that was done is the wrong test as you need the estradiol sensitive (LC-MS/MS) to truly know where your e2 levels sit.

Unfortunately the estradiol sensitive is not available through Lifelabs as only Dynacare offers it for the time being and you would have to look into seeing if there is a Dynacare located in BC (British Columbia).

Glad to hear your protocol is working out and you have experienced improvements.

It has only been 3 months and things should improve upon as time goes on!

 

[littlemanb]

Thanks guys..you are rght about the bilirubin. The doctor thinks I might have Gilbert’s disease which is not that serious but gives some sort of explanation for the bilirubin not being removed quick enough through the liver..the other item was the ferritin decrease which has lowered since starting TRT..I take iron in my vitamins which is interesting but my red blood cell count has improved quite a bit..I’m not on HCG..I have noticed some testicular shrinkage but not too bad..will they continue to shrink? My DHEA is also on the low side so I may start back with the supplementation..my doctor wanted me to stop when I started TRT..

As for the estrogen test you are right about Canada (very limited on testing and labs) but MarkM on this site did provide a conversion chart which isn’t perfect but it is helpful..

You guys have been great! I’ll keep everyone updated on my progress as time goes on..does anyone here do subq injections? Does anyone know where I can find 50CC, 28gm, 5/16 length disposable insulin needles..I can only find the 1/2 inch length everywhere I look..

Regards,

Mark

 

[madman]

Thanks guys..you are rght about the bilirubin. The doctor thinks I might have Gilbert’s disease which is not that serious but gives some sort of explanation for the bilirubin not being removed quick enough through the liver..the other item was the ferritin decrease which has lowered since starting TRT..I take iron in my vitamins which is interesting but my red blood cell count has improved quite a bit..I’m not on HCG..I have noticed some testicular shrinkage but not too bad..will they continue to shrink? My DHEA is also on the low side so I may start back with the supplementation..my doctor wanted me to stop when I started TRT..

As for the estrogen test you are right about Canada (very limited on testing and labs) but MarkM on this site did provide a conversion chart which isn’t perfect but it is helpful..

You guys have been great! I’ll keep everyone updated on my progress as time goes on..does anyone here do subq injections? Does anyone know where I can find 50CC, 28gm, 5/16 length disposable insulin needles..I can only find the 1/2 inch length everywhere I look..

Regards,

Mark

Regarding trt many inject sub-q and others shallow i.m./deep i.m. (not so common).

I have been injecting strictly sub-q (abdominal fat) almost 2 years!

If you are looking for insulin syringes (fixed) with a 5/16 (8mm) needle length than you would need to use 30-31 gauge as anything less is usually 1/2 inch length.

Here are some BD U-100 .5cc 28 gauge 1/2 inch length insulin syringes (100 box) from Canadian supplier.

BD U100 Insulin Syringe 1/2CC 28g x 1/2

Buy Needles International | Syringes & Needles | Discreet Shipping

There are many online suppliers in the US to purchase various insulin syringes (barrel/gauge/needle length) but you need to factor in exchange rates/shipping costs and whether they offer shipping to Canada as some do not.

 

[littlemanb]

Yes..I am currently using the BD 28gm 50 cc, 1/2 inch needle..they work well..I found it way more difficult to fill the 29 gm needles and almost impossible to fill the 30 gm needles..I tried them at the start..your probably right, I won’t find any 28 gm, 5/16 inch needles out there unless I go smaller which is way to much work to fill.

Yes..I too am glad I went subq..can you do subq anywhere on the thigh? If so, where would you inject?

Mark