Gene's Nitric Oxide Stack

midlifealpha · Mar 24, 2015

Some notes after the first month and a big thanks to Gene for answering questions:

1. I went kind of rushed, but managed to do the L-Arginine and L-Citrulline exactly as the First post in thread. I just got the GNC stuff for now and also purchased GNC's Horny Goat Weed. I have a feeling that that I am overdoing the HGW (icarlin).
2. Liquid Cia, I am probably hitting closer to 20 mg I marked off a couple spots on the extractor and it's difficult to see sometimes so my black mark that represents the lower 10 mg, I am usually over that. All of the numbers scrapped off on the one they supplied so I compared to the one unused one I have, put scotch tape around it, marked it, and another layer of scotch tape. Side effects of back pain only the first week.
3. I do take Lisinopril (25 MG) so I didn't get the Alphablocker. I am about to make a new order and will get the stuff at Vitacost. I know you can get the tri-mix shot from Defy but I've been hesistant to switch from my Orlando based Anti-Aging Doc. Orlando Doc does not put me on HCG by the way but this thread is about the stack. Also doing .25 mg of Sermorelin a day

Issues:
- Sex - Absolutely unbelievable improvement. Morning wood every day. Very horny libido is almost scary.
- Varicose Veins. Now I am under treatment for Varicose Veins. My Nurse Practiioner thought an NO stack was not a good idea. She's talking about the malfunctioning veins but said my vein's are absolutely huge. I disagreed I felt the pump I am getting in the veins and muscles in the upper body combined with the effects of ED being gone I don't care. I was taking 1/2 a 50 mg Viagra just to have sex and it wasn't working something of the time. Now I have zero failures, and get hard just brushing up against someone.

Am I risking anything by going with the NO with Varicose veins in the legs?

Diet - I totally disagree with the above poster about nutriional bang for the buck. Robb Wolk has a page in his Paleo book that shows the two most nutrient dense foods are broccoli and Steak if we are talking about vitamins/minerals per ounce of food. In any case I am very low carb. I'll eat pickles and sometimes drink the pickle juice throughout the day and have veggies with dinner but otherwise I eat mostly Beef and Chicken. Fish I don't really care for. Pork maybe once a week?

If you had Varicose Veins would you continue with NO stack? I am in therapy and getting Sclerotherapy every other week or so. I am at least following their advice of not deadlifting for now and if I decide to squat to keep it higher rep, lower weight. They felt my heavy deadlifting made the veins bigger than most people who go in with the issue.

Gene Devine · Mar 24, 2015

midlifealpha said:
Some notes after the first month and a big thanks to Gene for answering questions:

1. I went kind of rushed, but managed to do the L-Arginine and L-Citrulline exactly as the First post in thread. I just got the GNC stuff for now and also purchased GNC's Horny Goat Weed. I have a feeling that that I am overdoing the HGW (icarlin).
2. Liquid Cia, I am probably hitting closer to 20 mg I marked off a couple spots on the extractor and it's difficult to see sometimes so my black mark that represents the lower 10 mg, I am usually over that. All of the numbers scrapped off on the one they supplied so I compared to the one unused one I have, put scotch tape around it, marked it, and another layer of scotch tape. Side effects of back pain only the first week.
3. I do take Lisinopril (25 MG) so I didn't get the Alphablocker. I am about to make a new order and will get the stuff at Vitacost. I know you can get the tri-mix shot from Defy but I've been hesistant to switch from my Orlando based Anti-Aging Doc. Orlando Doc does not put me on HCG by the way but this thread is about the stack. Also doing .25 mg of Sermorelin a day

Issues:
- Sex - Absolutely unbelievable improvement. Morning wood every day. Very horny libido is almost scary.
- Varicose Veins. Now I am under treatment for Varicose Veins. My Nurse Practiioner thought an NO stack was not a good idea. She's talking about the malfunctioning veins but said my vein's are absolutely huge. I disagreed I felt the pump I am getting in the veins and muscles in the upper body combined with the effects of ED being gone I don't care. I was taking 1/2 a 50 mg Viagra just to have sex and it wasn't working something of the time. Now I have zero failures, and get hard just brushing up against someone.

Am I risking anything by going with the NO with Varicose veins in the legs?

Diet - I totally disagree with the above poster about nutriional bang for the buck. Robb Wolk has a page in his Paleo book that shows the two most nutrient dense foods are broccoli and Steak if we are talking about vitamins/minerals per ounce of food. In any case I am very low carb. I'll eat pickles and sometimes drink the pickle juice throughout the day and have veggies with dinner but otherwise I eat mostly Beef and Chicken. Fish I don't really care for. Pork maybe once a week?

If you had Varicose Veins would you continue with NO stack? I am in therapy and getting Sclerotherapy every other week or so. I am at least following their advice of not deadlifting for now and if I decide to squat to keep it higher rep, lower weight. They felt my heavy deadlifting made the veins bigger than most people who go in with the issue.

I have one nasty Varicose Vein in my left leg and sometimes it can get big but the NO stack never bothered it and it's not a problem for me.

We're all different but I think you are okay.

midlifealpha · Mar 25, 2015

Thanks Gene.

I forgot to mention one drug I am on is Omniprazole. Now I have a pretty nasty hernia in the upper abdomen and was stuck in a hospital for 4 days once because I couldn't hold anything down. I long suspected the hernia might have strangulated the part leading into the stomach but they never figured out what caused it, threw it up to GIRD and I've been on Omniprazole ever since.

I often wonder if this is a waste of time as I thought I read here or somewhere that it zaps magnesium.

Ironically the other OTC I was thinking of giving up was ZMA. Not sure why I need to take something that supposedly boosts T when I am on TRT. However there is a magnesium component to ZMA so I don't know. Given the cost of TRT+Semorelin+NO Stack I just thought cutting back unnecessary pills might be wise.

croaker24 · Mar 25, 2015

Mid -

I had a similar problem - misdiagnosis of GI issues which the lazy GI doc attributed to GERD and put me on a PPI. I reacted violently and they had to stop it. I had terrible insomnia - going 4 days w/o a wink of sleep, bad anxiety, my tongue and mouth turned sheet white and felt like they were on fire. It was a nightmare.

PIs will cause all kinds of absorption problems - magnesium, B12, etc. You are not supposed to use any for more than 2 weeks but the GI docs keep prescribing them long-term. I probably had some prior absorption issues so I was not getting the nutrients and the PPIs shoved me over the cliff.

Eventually they did some scoping and found that my reflux was actually within normal. They sent me to a dietician for the hell of it and she had me change my diet by removing gluten and dairy and move to a plant-based diet (light on lean meat). That seems to have started a turnaround - but then they found my overall T was like in the 100's.

My dietician believes that my low T was contributing to my GI issues along with some diet issues. As my T started to come back up on treatment, my GI system kept getting better. I think it was a combo - the plant-based diet helped to get my bacteria back to some balance by cutting out gluten, dairy, processed foods/fast foods, and sugar; while the T seemed to have quieted the immune system or at least helped it heal.

Now, my GI system is great - the best in long years.

Victorforbes · Mar 27, 2015

Great thread so far, started the stack and have a couple questions:

1. I got the beet crystals the dude mentioned above - are they still 1000 mg 3x a day? This would be pretty small amounts compared to what they recommend on the jar.

2. For the afternoon stack what is the best time to take it? My schedule is usually wake up at 6, lunch at 12, bed at 10. I know a lot of these should be on empty stomachs - so should the afternoon dose be a half hour before I eat? Ie dose at 12, eat at 1230.

Thanks for all the advice.

The Dude · Mar 27, 2015

Which brand beets did you get ?

Gene Devine · Mar 27, 2015

Victorforbes said:
Great thread so far, started the stack and have a couple questions:

1. I got the beet crystals the dude mentioned above - are they still 1000 mg 3x a day? This would be pretty small amounts compared to what they recommend on the jar.

2. For the afternoon stack what is the best time to take it? My schedule is usually wake up at 6, lunch at 12, bed at 10. I know a lot of these should be on empty stomachs - so should the afternoon dose be a half hour before I eat? Ie dose at 12, eat at 1230.

Thanks for all the advice.

I take my afternoon stack just before hitting the gym around 6 PM. I am a night owl so this works for me. Mid afternoon like 3 PM on an empty stomach is fine as well.

Jeff Frantz · Mar 27, 2015

Im still learning to navigate through the site. What exactly is the stack??

The Dude · Mar 27, 2015

Jeff Frantz said:
Im still learning to navigate through the site. What exactly is the stack??

Scroll Down and you will see the word "First" - click it and then read the first post.

Victorforbes · Mar 27, 2015

The Dude said:
Which brand beets did you get ?

I got the Salus red beet crystals as recommended earlier. Not sure how much to take per dosage though.

Thanks again

The Dude · Mar 27, 2015

Victorforbes said:
I got the Salus red beet crystals as recommended earlier. Not sure how much to take per dosage though.

Thanks again

Those are the best tasting ones, I've since found some cheaper ones that don't taste as good.

("Activz")

Salus lists one tablespoon as a serving, and that should easily be sufficient to get the nitric oxide going. One dose a day should be fine, you can do as much as two.

Alternately, you can try significantly less - based on the fact that Neo40 lozenges work on the basis of the beets content, and those have less than a half gram, and are known to be effective.

midlifealpha · Mar 28, 2015

Just curious if the stack changes or has alternatives (at least if Gene does) does that first thread get updated?

By the way I hope this isn't the wrong way to go. I know many on here are switching to the Defy NO shot... which isn't a bad idea if Defy is your supplier for TRT.

On amazon the folks were talking about their own NO Stacks so I assume others are experimenting as well.

Anyway here is the order on amazon. I am slightly concerned that my HGW package never uses the word icarin anywhere.

I'll have to figure out the powder mixing to get to the proper dosage but I am thinking of just getting three small drink cups with all the money I save on pills.
Each night make the three cups for the next day. Add water, shake, drink. Maybe the Mid-Day I add gets zero-Carb Isopure and some Creatine but most said they just shake up the powder and if anything is left over just add a little water and finish it off. As a low carber, I tend to have some fats at each meal so maybe MCT Oil too. I lift at home so it's not a big deal.

BulkSupplements Pure L-Arginine Base Powder (500 grams)
BulkSupplements Pure Grape Seed Extract Powder (100 grams) - Pycnogenol
BulkSupplements Pure L-Citrulline DL-Malate 2:1 Powder (100 grams)
Epimedium Leaf Extract Powder (HORNY GOAT WEED)

Jeff Frantz · Mar 28, 2015

This product (World A.B.S. Icariin 60 ) states 60% Icariin - 300 mg - 1 capsule ..... Is the Icariin 60% of 300 mg = 180 mg or is it 300 mg. of Icariin per capsule?

I noticed that this post is a year and half old.... Any other references to get Icariin at 150 mg??

Gene Devine · Mar 28, 2015

Jeff Frantz said:
This product (World A.B.S. Icariin 60 ) states 60% Icariin - 300 mg - 1 capsule ..... Is the Icariin 60% of 300 mg = 180 mg or is it 300 mg. of Icariin per capsule?

I noticed that this post is a year and half old.... Any other references to get Icariin at 150 mg??

I believe 60% was the strongest. Is there a 150?

This is where I get the Icariin 60: http://www.icariinhealth.com/pages/horny-goat-weed-icariin

Jeff Frantz · Mar 28, 2015

Hi Gene,

Your NO stack says to take 150 mg Icariin (Horney Goat Weed) So, I guess what I'm trying to say is..... if the bottle of Horney Goat Weed states it's "300 mg. 20% Icariins " is that a total of 60 mg. of Icarrins? or 300 mg. of Icariins?

The Dude · Mar 28, 2015

My personal experience is that both Tadalafil and Icariin inhibit PDE5, and Tadalafil is so much stronger that even a large does of Icariin does not do anything extra. (But Horny Goat Weed herb also helps libido) If you are not doing the Tadalafil, then the Icariin can be very helpful.

Jeff Frantz · Mar 28, 2015

Dude,

Thank you for your response. It is much appreciated. I was shopping for Icariin on-line because I was going to try doing Gene's NO stack.

3000 mg of L-Arginine
1500 mg of L-Citrulline
50 mg of Pycnogenol
150 mg of Icariin (Horny Goat Weed)

I'm trying to find the dose of 150 Icariin to purchase. When looking at different Horny Goat Weed products they come in a variety of different milligrams, 300, 750, 1000 etc..etc..etc.. Some of them state they have 10% Icariin and some say 20% and I found a Horny Goat Weed Product that states it has 60% Icariin. The NO stack Gene posted on this site states "150 mg. Icariin ( Horny Goat Weed )." I'm wondering if the 150 mg dose that he is referring to is the mg of the Horny Goat Weed product or of the Icariin that's in it. Example: if the bottle says Horney Goat Weed 750 milligrams 20% Icariin - am I supposed to take 20% of the 750 milligrams to determine theamount of Icariin Im getting??

midlifealpha · Mar 28, 2015

The thing that ticks me off about this Epimedium Leaf Extract Powder (HORNY GOAT WEED) is that unlike all the products from BulkSupplements which give you an idea of what different measurements yield in mg, there is nothing on this package anywhere.

Perhaps I am being a moron and there is a way to figure it out mathematically. Now, thanks to TheDude I am really not terribly worried because I do take Liquid Tadalafil and probably a little closer to the 20 mg per dose so I think can lower that. In that extraction syringe or plunger (not sure what it's called) that comes with the Liquid Cia it seems like the difference between 10 and 20 is pretty small and there is always an air pocket, and with my scotch-tape make shift lines I can never tell exactly what amount of Cia I take, but I damn sure know there is a difference in performance. And I am not talking about the gym but my worn out girlfriend and a FWB who suddenly wants to see me more often haha...

Now an interesting thing about the BulkSupplements Pure Grape Seed Extract Powder (100 grams) is that 1/64 of a tsp is 43 mg. So they say right on the package a rounded 1/64 would get me my Pycnogenol......but I sure as hell don't have tsp that is 1/64. Also I think it was the L-Arginine I figured out that I want to take 1 tsp + 1/8 of a tsp and I don't have a 1/8 either. So it looks like I need to buy some super small measurement spoons.

This way is a big money saver. I really am doing well financially I don't need to save the money I could just as soon get the Tri-Amino from Defy (100ML-$219) which is probably much more effective than the powder but there are literally no additives in this BulkSupplements stuff.

Nelson Vergel · Mar 31, 2015

From Jerry Brainum's newsletter ($10 per month and highly recommended): http://www.appliedmetabolics.com/

"Another popular bodybuilding supplement is Nitric oxide boosters. Such supplements are alleged to boost levels of nitric oxide, a substance involved among other effects, in dilating blood vessels. The thought is that taking such supplements will not only produce a more pronounced muscle pump, but also deliver more nutrients and oxygen to muscle during exercise. As with the GH boosters, the main ingredient in NO supplements is arginine. This makes sense, since arginine is the direct precursor for NO synthesis in the body. However, the production of NO isn't based on arginine, but rather the activity of enzymes that synthesize NO from arginine. In addition, the usual amount of arginine in NO supplements is not enough to significantly promote NO synthesis. The amount is kept low because larger doses of arginine can cause gastrointestinal upset. While NO supplements average about 4 grams of arginine per suggested dose, studies show it takes 18 grams of intravenous arginine to significantly boost NO synthesis. But many of the NO supplements also contain simple carbs. Simple carbs rapidly promote an insulin release, and guess what: insulin itself boosts NO release! So it's not the arginine in the supplements that is working, but the carbs. You can save a lot of money by avoiding NO supplements, and instead opting for methods that actually do boost NO release. Such methods include ingesting about 8 grams of the amino acid, citrulline, prior to workouts (citrulline is converted in the kidneys into arginine, providing a more reliable way of getting arginine into the blood). Also consuming about eight ounces of beet juice prior to training will lead to higher plasma levels of NO. Beet juice contains Nitrates, which are converted by enzymes in oral bacteria into nitrite, which is converted in the body into NO. You can also eat watermelon, the richest natural source of citrulline."

Gene Devine · Mar 31, 2015

Jeff Frantz said:
Dude,

Thank you for your response. It is much appreciated. I was shopping for Icariin on-line because I was going to try doing Gene's NO stack.

3000 mg of L-Arginine
1500 mg of L-Citrulline
50 mg of Pycnogenol
150 mg of Icariin (Horny Goat Weed)

I'm trying to find the dose of 150 Icariin to purchase. When looking at different Horny Goat Weed products they come in a variety of different milligrams, 300, 750, 1000 etc..etc..etc.. Some of them state they have 10% Icariin and some say 20% and I found a Horny Goat Weed Product that states it has 60% Icariin. The NO stack Gene posted on this site states "150 mg. Icariin ( Horny Goat Weed )." I'm wondering if the 150 mg dose that he is referring to is the mg of the Horny Goat Weed product or of the Icariin that's in it. Example: if the bottle says Horney Goat Weed 750 milligrams 20% Icariin - am I supposed to take 20% of the 750 milligrams to determine theamount of Icariin Im getting??

The pill is 50 mg with 20% Icariin. Three pills equal to 150 mg but still 20% Icariin.

The 60% is available online and I provided a link to it here.

Gene's Nitric Oxide Stack

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